Please bring map boss hp down

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Baron01 a écrit :

Boss HP increase while noticeable was not a problem for me until I decided to run Quarry and after that Mud Flats. Quarry boss is a chaos sentinel, which means my -60 resistance (usual practice for me when playing SSF) became a huge problem. Amethyst flask was no great help due to boss huge HP and need to reposition myself very often, which meant I run out of charges while not reducing boss' HP much. It bacame mix of chasing after flask charges and panic moments where my HP disappeared under barrage of chaos spells. This is perfect example of boss where HP buff is a problem--damage output of the boss is maintained while HP is significantly increased to a point where flasks can not carry you through the fight.

Next example is Tunneltrap in Mud Flats. This boss is for a while known as bane of melee, however, with adequate damage output and some flasks you could defeat him with reasonable safety. This approach got nuked by 3.0 where his HP is so high that you will need to spend too much time in his vicinity while only having limited flasks as pre-3.0.

No more problems with trolltrap even in 3.0. Boss do 0 dps while stunned.

Why do some of you think having more HP means the boss is more challenging? what the fuck dude lol

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I_NO a écrit :

Why do some of you think having more HP means the boss is more challenging? what the fuck dude lol

You might need to deal with some bosse's mechanics that would have been just cheezed before, and needing to actually interact with the boss .... instead of just watch him die before anything happens really, is definitely a step forward to challenging content.

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Fruz a écrit :

You mean a perfect example of a fight when you cannot just pop your flask and burst the boss down, ignoring its mechanics and just brute forcing him ?
Sounds like a very good thing to me.

This has nothing to do with ignoring boss mechanics. It is just example where prolonged exposure to a boss can be extraordinary deadly--chaos sentinel spawns choas storm, choas decay and also does chaos based direct attack. Chaos resistance is always a problem so I tend to solve this problem by using Amethyst flasks. This is no longer viable solution in 3.0 due to increased HP of bosses in general.
All I'm saying is that increased HP of some bosses with very deadly attacks should be properly adjusted to reflect increased time you need to engage those bosses.

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Fruz a écrit :

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I_NO a écrit :

Why do some of you think having more HP means the boss is more challenging? what the fuck dude lol

You might need to deal with some bosse's mechanics that would have been just cheezed before, and needing to actually interact with the boss .... instead of just watch him die before anything happens really, is definitely a step forward to challenging content.

No nothing is interesting it's the same fucking shit just takes longer.

That's not challenging you know what's challenging guardians see that's challenging. What does t1 - t15 do?

Nothing they don't do anything special they auto attack and do 1 special move.

OH BOY I'M SO FUCKING EXCITED and they drop dogshit loot please.

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Fruz a écrit :

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I_NO a écrit :

Why do some of you think having more HP means the boss is more challenging? what the fuck dude lol

You might need to deal with some bosse's mechanics that would have been just cheezed before, and needing to actually interact with the boss .... instead of just watch him die before anything happens really, is definitely a step forward to challenging content.

Except Vaal Pact and mitigation exist, so..............

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allbusiness a écrit :

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Fruz a écrit :

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I_NO a écrit :

Why do some of you think having more HP means the boss is more challenging? what the fuck dude lol

You might need to deal with some bosse's mechanics that would have been just cheezed before, and needing to actually interact with the boss .... instead of just watch him die before anything happens really, is definitely a step forward to challenging content.

Except Vaal Pact and mitigation exist, so..............

Yepp, mitigation is kinda ok, VP though.... personally I think VP, in its current form, needs to go away, but that is for another thread.


A side question regarding boss HP... what would be the aim for combat time with the boss?
aka how long should it take?
(yes loot should be adjusted to reflect it)

The old <2sec standard was just stupid...
10 min is a tad long in my book.

So the question is: What would be ok? 5 min? 3 min? 30sec?


From that answer comes adjustments in HP, damage, loot and so on...

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allbusiness a écrit :

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Fruz a écrit :

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I_NO a écrit :

Why do some of you think having more HP means the boss is more challenging? what the fuck dude lol

You might need to deal with some bosse's mechanics that would have been just cheezed before, and needing to actually interact with the boss .... instead of just watch him die before anything happens really, is definitely a step forward to challenging content.

Except Vaal Pact and mitigation exist, so..............

Well VP is still there, that's true ....
Not everybody is using it though, I hope that this keystone will actually be reworked someday, or removed.

Mitigation does not allow you to just facetank everything, I guess some builds can get away with it in most cases though.

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Baron01 a écrit :

This has nothing to do with ignoring boss mechanics. It is just example where prolonged exposure to a boss can be extraordinary deadly--chaos sentinel spawns choas storm, choas decay and also does chaos based direct attack. Chaos resistance is always a problem so I tend to solve this problem by using Amethyst flasks. This is no longer viable solution in 3.0 due to increased HP of bosses in general.

Perfect example where you could actually play around and dodge, but you have just been used to facetank because the boss was dying too fast.
Now, you have to actually deal with it, not just pop a flask and facetank it as if it was nothing.

You could use more portals too I guess though, this boss is not deadly enough to remove the possibility of facetanking it.

If you nerf the dps of those bosses so that you can just facetank them without much troubles, but it just takes longer .... then there is absolutely no meaning, it just makes the encounter last longer without it being any interesting.

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I_NO a écrit :

No nothing is interesting it's the same fucking shit just takes longer.

That's not challenging you know what's challenging guardians see that's challenging. What does t1 - t15 do?

Nothing they don't do anything special they auto attack and do 1 special move.

If you have to deal with some of the boss abilities instead of just seeing him die almost instantly, then you might have to deal with it.

You know why guardians are challenging ?
Because they are scary AND they don't die like flies.
And GGG has done one step towards that, they made most other bosses not die like flies anymore.

Mitigation and Vaal Pact exist together though, which means you're still face tanking. People are still face tanking Shaper, the only difference is that they move once every 20 seconds to avoid the slam. Woopty doo. GGG has done so much.

Everything I post here was done on a 50-70k dps character, and I was actually one of the players worried about map boss hp:

The boss hp on T1-T5 maps and T6-T10 maps seems ok. Doesn't take too long to kill those. The issue starts with T11 and higher maps, those boss hp amounts are insane! And that is without the hp mod which can be rolled.

The first ten tiers map bosses feel good, they don't die too fast and force you to learn their tactics. At T11 and higher the map bosses and dodge mechanics themselves feel good, but the boss hp is way too high! Their hp should be cut by 25-40%.

Also, since bosses now have alot more hp this forces players to get alot more dps... this in effect makes reflect a mechanic that should not exist anymore, or should be easily countered! Maybe add godpowers that cover 100% reflect damage(all types), or some nodes on the tree.

Other than that, the game feels awesome now!

PS: My build had quite some dps, not every build can reach this.