Are Stash Tabs Pay To Win ? Science
"So your argument is that stash tabs are only pay 2 win if they are being used? Since you are now focusing on empty tabs, that's what it sounds like. Empty stash tabs cannot possibly be an advantage, so can't be P2W, can they? Why are we talking about empty stash tabs? Guild Leader The Amazon Basin <BASIN> Play Nice and Show Some Class www.theamazonbasin.com Dernière édition par mark1030#3643, le 11 juin 2014 à 21:16:35
|
![]() |
"So do all the other microtransactions also qualify as P2W in your book? Because they have the potential to be used as an advantage. They allow you to see in the midst of a full screen of graphics which skills are coming from you (giving you an advantage of knowing your position better than somebody who can't see which skills originate from their character if others also use the same skills). They also allow you to see if your auras are on or off easier as well as if you have buffs active like Arctic Armour. If you do not count those things as P2W also even though they have "potential" to give an advantage, why do you think they're different? Guild Leader The Amazon Basin <BASIN>
Play Nice and Show Some Class www.theamazonbasin.com |
![]() |
" I didn't argue that, but it's quite obviously true. To be pedantic about it, you could say it's necessary for them to be used for it to constitute an advantage, but not sufficient, as you correctly pointed out that it is possible to misuse them. " You brought up empty stash tabs, with your compare-it-to-an-underused-house analogy. I simply pointed out that unlike an empty house, empty stash tabs don't require you to pay taxes, they don't need to be maintained or cleaned, etc. |
![]() |
"Why do you keep coming back to 'misuse'? Using them takes time. You don't have to misuse them for them to take time. Just plain using them does. I think it's clear that everyone who says they are Pay 2 Win is basing their whole argument that they save TIME over muling and that's why they are P2W. So it's a given on both sides that time has value. If it didn't, there'd be no argument at all. And people with fewer tabs will spend less time putting stuff in and taking out of them (unless we use your argument that they are misusing them, but we'll not count those people). Is there anything I've just said that you dispute? Guild Leader The Amazon Basin <BASIN>
Play Nice and Show Some Class www.theamazonbasin.com |
![]() |
The more I buy, the more I lose!
#losing |
![]() |
The OP's argument hinged on the value of using extra stash tabs to store crap that can be turned in for orb recipes. I've already addressed how ridiculous this is due to it being so low on the list of "Great Ways to Get Rich." It seems the greatest argument here is more stash tabs equals more space to store awesome items and currency. Let's assume there is someone who has 10+ stash tabs filled with exalted orbs from liquidating all the best gear he constantly keeps stored in his remaining 100+ stash tabs. Let's say he attained all this wealth from running a successful store from the forums.
Well, I would like to meet this person because I have never seen anyone who has enough time to be both Donald Trump and play the actual game. I have also never known anyone who actually procures THAT MUCH awesome loot (God knows I never loot any). More than likely, the tabs are filled with crap that does nothing more than collect dust. And how has being the Donald Trump of PoE given him a real advantage in the actual game? The best items in the game can be attained with much less currency requiring no more than several stash tabs, at most, to accumulate the necessary wealth to make it to the top. The entire argument that more stash tab space equals "Pay to Win" is nothing more than some weak argument posed by sophists in an attempt to make it stronger. Bottom line is having more stash tab space DOESN'T MAKE A DIFFERENCE IN MAKING IT TO THE TOP. And if there are players at the top who happen to also have a great deal more stash tab space, that doesn't conclude that it was due to their fvcking extra stash tab space! They played the fvcking game well. |
![]() |
" No. Not that you've read most of what I've said, but my personal line of "P2W" is above Stash Tabs. I'm not blind to the fact that stash tabs can be used for an advantage, but I don't consider it game-crushing. I used to consider it to be quite a huge advantage back in CB when the matching names recipe was much, much easier and free accounts were not possible... but that's not the case anymore. Cosmetic effects are even lower gains of efficiency over the normal player than stash tabs, so obviously I have no problem with them. If the question you're really asking is "are cosmetics an advantage over not having them", then it's a mixed bag. Some do act as beacons to make the player stand out (most of the glowing helmets). Others are not particularly more noticeable than the default, or even less noticeable in some cases (hatred v. skull hatred). I will concede that it's very possible theoretically for cosmetics to provide an undue advantage. The simplest solution for GGG is to allow people to earn a glowing helmet or two without paying for them. In general, earning cosmetics need not be a purely money thing. As it turns out, it's already possible for people to earn cosmetics without money (either placing high in races and getting Golden Footprints (and other demigod's mtxs), or by killing Atziri and gaining her mtx, or whatever else GGG adds in the future). In the future, I would really appreciate it if you spend as much time reading my posts as I do reading yours. " Describing the other side as weak and sophist doesn't make your point valid nor make other points invalid. The words you are struggling to find are that Stash Tabs provide a very small advantage. So small, in fact, that it shouldn't be considered to affect ladder placement. Separately, you personally have no problems with selling very small advantages for money, with no other way to receive those very small advantages other than paying money. Is it P2W for GGG to sell something that increases your character's DPS by 1? I would wager that you would say no. I would also say no. I would wager that Veruski would say yes. Nobody is wrong because "P2W" is a personal threshold. However, is it an advantage? The answer should be unanimously yes. A small advantage is an advantage. Dernière édition par pneuma#0134, le 12 juin 2014 à 03:01:45
|
![]() |
" Wrong... P.S. - Removing my posts doesn't invalidate my points either... And, since there's nothing to accomplish here, I'm done now. Dernière édition par Gemdraco#2335, le 12 juin 2014 à 04:42:20
|
![]() |
it amuses me how so many people are arguing against the obvious, that stash tabs are pay to win pay for serious advantage. Is it so bad to just admit the obvious?
It amuses me how so often they try to justify this talk by resorting to "chaos recipe", avoiding the FACT, that there are other useful recipes that generate currency that CAN'T POSSIBLY BE DONE EVEN 1/100 AS FAST as you can with 100 STASH TABS TO STORE THE ITEMS. it amuses me how when people talk advantage for cash stash tabs, they ignore the advantages by saying you can open multiple accounts. i logged in just to express how amusing this little thread has become. words like, "my stash tabs mostly remain empty". SO, WHAT? words like, "my things just get thrown around and they are all disorganized". SO, WHAT? words like, "it may be faster that opening multiple accounts and characters to sift through my items, but that's not an advantage". HAHAHAHAHAHAH. seriously. Comedy. Stash tabs ARE pay to win PAY for advantage. i also find it amusing how we all know, for a fact... a 100% FACT... that if we were in a currency race, 100 stash tabs would beat 4 and mules, every, single, time. If everyone was exactly the same skill. I just wish GGG would create a less dull, boring kind of Pay For Advantage. They could make a pet that attacks but NOOOOOO, they can only make a bigger closet for hoarders who want to run alchemy recipes. And chaos sets and whatever else, so they can trade the currency in for high end gear. Stash Tabs, pay to win no matter how messy yours are, no matter how disorganized yours are, no matter if you only run a chaos recipe, no matter how many mules you may play with. no matter if you bought so many stash tabs and just don't want to admit they you are what you said you don't like. you are a pay for advantage person. 100 stash tabs lets them generate the ex's etc they need to get the highest end gear, for themselves or their friends. it's what top players do. have no school or job to get to so they play a league start for 2 weeks straight 16 hours a day, with their friends stacking them with leveled gems and gear that they all were finding, or buying with their mass stash tab currency drive aka cash for advantage. stash tabs being a huge part of their collective pool of little ex's etc they use to stack these people up. Stash Tabs = Pay to Win Advantage. End of Story. The next lesson for the 8 year olds in class, will be why having no job or no school etc, is the best way to win GGG's Leagues. And why GGG should obviously, just as obvious as stash tab advantages, change it so the jobless etc can't just play for 16 hours a day. like telling me i should be in a race, but i can only race half as long as someone else. one of the worst aspects of a game's design, ever. almost as bad as no pay to win except boring stash tabs. almost as bad as scion. |
![]() |
" Wrong. Firstly, insulting everyone while tossing your faulty claims around isn't nearly as funny as you think it is. In fact, it's not even remotely humorous. Secondly, using every available recipe to get as much currency as you can from them doesn't make you as rich as you think it does (not even with 100 tabs hoarding crappy rares and uniques that you would've been better off vendoring instead of wasting time endlessly organizing in all the stash tabs you could afford). Thirdly, attacking unemployed people because they have more time to play the game is achieving a whole new level of absurdity. Ultimately, what are you trying to achieve here? Even if you manage to convince everyone that stash tabs are P2W, albeit to some insignificant degree, what have you gained? Are you that hungry for attention that you need to get it here? From us (people who should be relatively insignificant to your life)? |
![]() |