A broad P2W definition in law would paint premium stash tabs P2W

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DarthSki44 a écrit :

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LowBudget780 a écrit :

Like instead of just looking at a calendar to figure out the date, you pull out a starchart and spend 3 hours staring into the sky instead.

Calendars are P2W!! Boycott!!

you're really going full whiteknight with the sarcastic comments and nonsensical arguments about PoE being single player (which it isn't) and therefore the advantages provided by spending real money on stash tabs, which is the definition of P2W, can't possibly make PoE a P2W game.

Just accept that PoE is P2W and move on. It might not be as P2W as some other games out there but that doesn't change the fact that stash tabs do indeed count as P2W.

you're not even part of GGG's PR team, you don't have to go to such lengths to keep defending their monetization practices anyway.

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CAPSLOCK_ON a écrit :

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DarthSki44 a écrit :

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LowBudget780 a écrit :

Like instead of just looking at a calendar to figure out the date, you pull out a starchart and spend 3 hours staring into the sky instead.

Calendars are P2W!! Boycott!!

you're really going full whiteknight with the sarcastic comments and nonsensical arguments about PoE being single player (which it isn't) and therefore the advantages provided by spending real money on stash tabs, which is the definition of P2W, can't possibly make PoE a P2W game.

Just accept that PoE is P2W and move on. It might not be as P2W as some other games out there but that doesn't change the fact that stash tabs do indeed count as P2W.

you're not even part of GGG's PR team, you don't have to go to such lengths to keep defending their monetization practices anyway.

Lol I've been called many things, but white knight for GGG is not among them.

Idgaf about this company one way or the other. P2W is a way bigger topic than PoE.


Because of that, I will call out stupid P2W justice warriors. This is way beyond fucking premium stash tabs that GGG offers. I hate P2W crybabies that have zero clue about game monetization, marketing, and how narrowminded they are around the why's of the industry.

All games are P2W at different levels is a stupid stance.

Assuming the item is already in a tab:

W/O Premium Stash Tab:
1). Minimize game
2). Open web browser
3). Navigate to website
4). Log in
5). Go to forum
6). Create post
7). Open website stash and locate item
8). Populate listing
9). Submit post
10). Go back to game

W Public Premium $tash Tab:
1). Set price

Now, do that for every single item you want to sell.


You are literally paying money to accomplish things quicker and with less steps and to use less tools (web browser) to achieve game progression faster. You are paying money to not have to do something that those not paying have to do in order to achieve the exact same result and progression.

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LowBudget780 a écrit :

There is a third party app...

That you don't have to use if you pay real $. That's pretty much the point. Pay money, jump though less hoops for game progression then those that don't pay money. Don't pay money, jump through more hoops to get the exact same progression.

What's the solution, then? Operating under the assumption, as you lot are wont to do, that PEE TWO DUBBLEYOO is the gravest of sins against humanity and needs to be expunged with blood and fire, all those who've ever nefariously benefited from it put to the sword?

For sure any government of any country would be pleased to take back the hand, control, and taxes, on "new" internet video games gambling.

Protecting children (or vulnerable adults) of gambling addiction is something i approve.

POE-like games are directly on the line, punitive RNG provoking the reward system addiction etc...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Video_game_addiction
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reward_system#Addiction

HARD TO IMPLEMENT.

You know... it's perfectly fine with me if you want to call PoE pay to win. It's fine if you don't.

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LowBudget780 a écrit :

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mulepoe1gmail a écrit :

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LowBudget780 a écrit :

There is a third party app...

That you don't have to use if you pay real $. That's pretty much the point. Pay money, jump though less hoops for game progression then those that don't pay money. Don't pay money, jump through more hoops to get the exact same progression.

Oh yeah I totally agree, premium stash tabs are definitely p2w. Only the blindest of fanboys will argue otherwise.

"Fanboys" also like to forget about essence tab, fragment tab.. and most important map tab. Playing without map tab = total_hyper_mega_massive waste time. You want Elder and have no map tab? Dont you have stash tab + trade makro? = gl & hf suckers who do not use this or other tabs: "I make profit on you you slugs" owners say :).

By the number of replies since yesterday it's clear people aren't terribly interested in spending that free time in game.

Now I get why some folks want to call any paid advantage as pay to win, because the interpretation of "winning" can be so vague.

More stash tabs, more space, easier trading - clearly advantages

More junk collected, less stringent looting habits, more time wasted micromanaging - disadvantages that can arise out of that same space, look at the remove tabs for folks who've accrued them over multiple leagues, hell plenty of league players will tell you they have no desire to sort through it all.

In other words, it's not some clear win.

Now, let's bring up a "real" case of P2W that got EA (as usual it seems nowadays) a lot of heat.

https://www.cnet.com/news/after-battlefront-ii-ea-admits-to-image-problem/

THAT is what players are against largely because of its predatory nature.

Stash tabs are an advantageous more than not, and requires monetary investment. But the game is free and up until more recently with the proposed atlas rotating every league now or fossils and resonators taking up way more space than they should, tabs have been well within reason given there is no initial purchase price to have otherwise full access to the game.

It's not an issue about being labeled a P2W player - it's a matter of people wanting to blanket any fee that isn't cosmetic as automatically pay to win. The market has changed dramatically over the years and micro transactions are gonna be here a long while. If you simply write off everything as P2W, it no longer means anything and allows the truly predatory practices to fly under the radar.

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SeCKSEgai a écrit :

By the number of replies since yesterday it's clear people aren't terribly interested in spending that free time in game.

It doesn't matter if P2W is mass produced or not, it's still pay to win.

It doesn't matter if you use your paid advantages against you, it's still a privilege which cannot be accessed without money.

People who TRULY want to P2W can do that in absolutely every game, just not through official channels.
I think it's just hilarious that people defend stash tabs as not being P2W and boasting how the game is "Just cosmetics, no P2W, all legit br0s!".

I personally have nothing against stash tabs as they have been for a while and although it's a completely new topic now - the "pay to win feature" is becoming a pillar on which the game is being designed around, producing a worse end product than what could have been without it.