Chris Wilson defends instant logout with all the wrong excuses
" Except this was decided from the get go and not due to desync. It was a conscious design decision, not because of the existence of desync. Dernière édition par allbusiness#6050, le 15 janv. 2018 à 13:11:30
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" Thank for the topic link, great read. Also i'm being very nitpicky here, but you can't logout/Alt+F4 to save yourself from oneshots. It's instant. " "Rest of us"? You can't Alt+F4 if you're dead, everybody needs them. I like how fast POE can be. It really gets adrenaline going. And they would need to slow the game probably significant amount if they wanted to add timed logouts. Otherwise, HC would be dead. |
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"if a game (any game in the world, be it football, basketball, track, power lifting, video game, whatever) is quasi-competitive, people will ALWAYS tread the line (and be very tempted to cheat) of whats allowed because you know, 'if you arent, then you arent trying hard enough' original poe design had a lot of things invested in races. hell, closed beta poe had races more popular than actual content. you see where Im going with this ? any quasi-competitive game has to be designed with category 2 in mind, not category 1, if you want to keep the 'competitive' part intact in any way shape or form. either that or you cease to be competitive altogether. which is what youre suggesting. sorry, I reject that notion. |
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also, like I say, people are very short-sighted.
remove logout and people will abuse portals to no extent since its almost as good. logout macro will send fin/ack in 300ms and you can open a portal and tp in ~1s so thats only a 700ms difference (plus small chance that zoning bugged out and you took some damage) yall remember how helmann (a very respected player, a beast racer in the past) got world first hc kitava kill ? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FaUn2sHJrgM every time a portal is used for a reason or for no reason, take a shot of your favorite hard liquor, then get back at me. so really, youd have to put timers on portals as well. and guess who will get pissed because of that ? the crowd that clears their shaped maps in 10 seconds (wait another 10 seconds to tp back to town...haha) |
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" I'd be fine with leaving instant portals in the game, for the following reasons: - Having the presence of mind to open your invo and use a portal scroll when you're about to die qualifies as a skill in my book. If you use a Portal gem, that carries its own opportunity cost, even in a weapon swap. - While portalling out might save you, portalling back in might be just as dangerous if you left your portal in the middle of a large pack or similar. - Unlike a logout macro, a portal macro that both opens a portal and goes through it is illegal as it breaks the "one server action per button press" rule. A macro that only opens the portal is slightly more problematic, but still not as egregious as instant logging out. - Some encounters explicitly forbid the use of portals, which in the current system doesn't make any sense since you can always just instalog anyway. As for Helmann's vid: you do realize that this only works in the campaign, where you have unlimited portals into the same encounter. The limited number of portals into maps already solves this problem, so that's irrelevant. |
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" where did qarl say that damage levels are unreasonable and require logging out? Read what I actually wrote. " I care a lot about dying in sc if Im playing a serious character. One shots are everywhere? Ok, well Im playing this game non stop, well over 12,000 hours played by now in the last 5 years. I get 1 shot on a serious character maybe once per year atm. So you are saying they have no option but to put 1 shots everywhere because of logouts, and my experience of the game is that theres virtually no 1 shots in the game at all. Im a person who plays a truly extreme amount of hours, if they were everywhere then I would be getting 1 shot. If they were even quite rare I would be getting 1 shot a lot, the reality is that I virtually never get 1 shot. the difference between us is probably how we are building characters. When people say the game is full of 1 shots I dont buy the idea that theyre not doing wrong. When we talk about build diversity I dont buy the idea that its a bad thing for weak builds to die to stuff. The build game is only meaningful if theres stuff that works and stuff that doesnt. I dont believe the balance is perfect, I think some forms of defence are too weak, some forms of offence are too weak, but its not an overall design flaw in the game. Theres particular mechanics we can argue need rebalanced in terms of player defences, and if people want to argue the case and give examples of their specific experiences maybe Id agree or disagree on a case by case. A blanket "The game is full of 1 shots!"... no, I dont agree, and I dont think thats my opinion, I think that is a fact I have witnessed. I love all you people on the forums, we can disagree but still be friends and respect each other :)
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" True 1 shots don't happen often, but getting instant bursted to the point you can't react is very common place especially if the map mods align. Arguing otherwise would only show that you're just arguing just to argue or to troll people. Your original premise was that this game wasn't balanced around the ability to logging out, when all evidence is to the contrary, especially when Chris who is the current head and original founder of the company/game has gone on record to state that the game was designed with you having the ability to log out of fights. Think about it, if you're playing HC, and you don't logout, you are at a distinct disadvantage versus someone who does because the game was balanced with the idea that people can and WILL use the logout function. Dernière édition par allbusiness#6050, le 15 janv. 2018 à 18:07:03
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" As you wish. https://www.reddit.com/r/pathofexile/comments/7qoa5u/why_meta_is_a_dirty_word/ But don't get your hopes up. Thoughtful-but-unpopular posts get buried quite quickly in reddit. " None of your premises are wrong, but your conclusion doesn't follow. I think you are missing the forest for the trees, sir, because you are still looking at a different dichotomy. It is not necessary to deliberately design exploits into your game (notice how Chris and co. always talk about a "moving meta?") in order to make it appeal to serious competitive gamers, and it never has been. In fact it makes no sense, because "meta" by definition is the subversion of game design. If this is too abstract for you, consider the following post I made a few months back for a concrete example of how focusing on Category 2 gamers is hurting the game: " Wash your hands, Exile!
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" no it wasnt " it hardly ever happens to me, so define very common? If you mean a lot of people with badly geared and/or built characters die often then yeah, of course. If youre trying to tell me its very common for a well put together character being played well to get bursted down quicker than they can react then we must have a very different idea of what very common means, because i would describe the frequency of that event as very rarely. I love all you people on the forums, we can disagree but still be friends and respect each other :)
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" That's your quote. Verbatim. So yes, your premise was that you thought the game's damage wasn't balanced around logging out when Chris and Qarl have gone on record and stated otherwise. If you're playing HC and you're not logging out, you are at a distinct advantage versus others. If you're pushing for 100, you're at a distinct disadvantage versus others. Also, considering how much worthless bullshit you spew out at this point, I'm not sure whether to take you seriously or not anymore. You think you are better than every HC player on the planet. And yet there are regular instances (with actual video evidence) of plenty of star aligning moments where you can and will take an absurd amount of damage without being able to react. But we are supposed to believe that 'if you build right' all of that is unavoidable. This is about as bad as sidtherat's 4k can play red maps comment rofl. Dernière édition par allbusiness#6050, le 15 janv. 2018 à 19:52:03
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