The 4 stash tab that free to players get is just not enough anymore.

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databeaver a écrit :

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JoeShmo a écrit :

It's curious that you and the "gentleman" above you consider 100 hours of something as "entitled".
I mean, I laughed when the guy above you equated that to a $100k car.

My mistake, I didn't realize Lamborghinis were so cheap. I was shooting for more like a million dollars, but I was too lazy to check prices. Perhaps a Bugatti Veyron would be more appropriate.

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JoeShmo a écrit :

And we're talking about a virtual video game item here ...why should someone spend 500 hours to get one? Do you have no concept of time? 500 hours ....20 days /played to get a single item. The fact anyone would call that "minimum" or an "adequate" time to get something is astounding to me.

Why indeed. The item has an interesting and fairly powerful gimmick which will surely boost the performance of any build. At the same time it's also unpredictable enough that I have a hard time imagining a build that would not work without a Headhunter. Why this guy is so obsessed over it or other items in the same price range is beyond me.

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JoeShmo a écrit :

It just amazes me at the irony of calling someone entitled, for wanting to have something done after even 100 hours of doing something, let alone "just" 30 hours. Why would a head hunter cost a bare minimum of $5,000 to acquire?

Supply and demand. I may not understand why the item is so coveted, but I do understand that it's very rare. If you go on the trade section and search for Headhunter, you'll see that prices start at around 45 exa. It would take me about 2000 hours to acquire that much currency, but I'm a fairly slow player. It takes me 10-ish minutes to clear a map and I've heard that the really fast players can do it in two minutes.

This game is intentionally designed so that certain items are exceedingly rare. Those items give the hardcore no-life players something to chase. They are not intended as something every player can acquire. So yes, it's extremely entitled to want one for a fraction of the effort the really good players put into it. It's like calling Bugattin and saying "Hey, you have those nice cars and I'd really like one. I've been working very hard at Burger King so do you think you could sell me one for $20k?".

There are other games which are designed so that every player can reasonable obtain everything in the game. Diablo III or Torchlight II for example. Consider playing something else than Path of Exile if you can't accept the fact that some items in the game may be unobtainable for you.

I think you're trying to over complicate ..or dismiss ...the premise of the argument.

We're talking 100 hours of effort for an item, which is not a fixed monetary value.

If you can earn 1 ex an hour ...you're entitled to a head hunter in 45 hours ..far less than 100. That's the point of conjecture in the conversation ..and why calling someone "entitled" for a hundred hours of work is nonsense; especially in a game where RNG plays a big factor in most of one's wealth, like having doctor cards drop for you or finding items that you can sell for several Ex at a time.

I didn't make an argument that we shouldn't have rare items, or that you should be able to have everything you want whenever it's convenient for you. The point was that calling someone out for literally 100 hours worth of work is amazing to me, as if 100 hours of work is worth nothing.

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Relationship a écrit :

So you are making the argument that all utilities should be free, how does that make sense?

The root of the argument is that the game isn't pay to win. Because no matter the argument: A person with a premium tab and person B without one can do the same things just person A can do it quicker/easier. Sure, they make people frustrated by making them do trivial things repeatedly but that doesn't mean that it's pay to win at all.

Not sure where you got an argument that all utilities should be free, or how that even relates to the context of the conversation.

Nor how you figured that the "root" of the argument is whether the game is "pay to win".

Or how there is no argument that can be made that someone with a premium tab has a paid advantage over someone who doesn't.

Regardless of that, what bothers me the most is that you seem to forget ( or never knew ) how hard it was to trade for items when all you had was "trade chat". I don't see how anyone could make a respectable argument that you can achieve the same level of trading ( not talking convenience ) using trade chat as someone who just uses a premium tab; let alone the affect it has on your non-trading gameplay time. It's pretty much universally agreed on that trade chat was the worst kind of cancer you could deal with in this game, and we would never want to go back to that ever. Ever.

Id like to see how you fair getting a specific rare item sold, or getting a currency trade that isn't at a loss, via chat. Because that's not a contest of how quick or easy it is, it's a matter of if you can at all. Which would prove whether it's "pay to win" or not. Getting a better deal is not a convenience.

This thread has gotten way too silly.

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JoeShmo a écrit :

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Relationship a écrit :

So you are making the argument that all utilities should be free, how does that make sense?

The root of the argument is that the game isn't pay to win. Because no matter the argument: A person with a premium tab and person B without one can do the same things just person A can do it quicker/easier. Sure, they make people frustrated by making them do trivial things repeatedly but that doesn't mean that it's pay to win at all.

Not sure where you got an argument that all utilities should be free, or how that even relates to the context of the conversation.

Nor how you figured that the "root" of the argument is whether the game is "pay to win".

Or how there is no argument that can be made that someone with a premium tab has a paid advantage over someone who doesn't.

Regardless of that, what bothers me the most is that you seem to forget ( or never knew ) how hard it was to trade for items when all you had was "trade chat". I don't see how anyone could make a respectable argument that you can achieve the same level of trading ( not talking convenience ) using trade chat as someone who just uses a premium tab; let alone the affect it has on your non-trading gameplay time. It's pretty much universally agreed on that trade chat was the worst kind of cancer you could deal with in this game, and we would never want to go back to that ever. Ever.

Id like to see how you fair getting a specific rare item sold, or getting a currency trade that isn't at a loss, via chat. Because that's not a contest of how quick or easy it is, it's a matter of if you can at all. Which would prove whether it's "pay to win" or not. Getting a better deal is not a convenience.

It's not about having the same level of anything? It's the fact that it's possible. Everything that A PREMIUM TAB CAN DO can be done without it. IS IT FAST AND IS IT EASY ISN'T THE POINT, it's that it's possible. Getting a better deal is a convenience that's why you pay auctioneers in real life to sell your stuff or why you get a real estate agent to sell your house.

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Relationship a écrit :

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JoeShmo a écrit :

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Relationship a écrit :

So you are making the argument that all utilities should be free, how does that make sense?

The root of the argument is that the game isn't pay to win. Because no matter the argument: A person with a premium tab and person B without one can do the same things just person A can do it quicker/easier. Sure, they make people frustrated by making them do trivial things repeatedly but that doesn't mean that it's pay to win at all.

Not sure where you got an argument that all utilities should be free, or how that even relates to the context of the conversation.

Nor how you figured that the "root" of the argument is whether the game is "pay to win".

Or how there is no argument that can be made that someone with a premium tab has a paid advantage over someone who doesn't.

Regardless of that, what bothers me the most is that you seem to forget ( or never knew ) how hard it was to trade for items when all you had was "trade chat". I don't see how anyone could make a respectable argument that you can achieve the same level of trading ( not talking convenience ) using trade chat as someone who just uses a premium tab; let alone the affect it has on your non-trading gameplay time. It's pretty much universally agreed on that trade chat was the worst kind of cancer you could deal with in this game, and we would never want to go back to that ever. Ever.

Id like to see how you fair getting a specific rare item sold, or getting a currency trade that isn't at a loss, via chat. Because that's not a contest of how quick or easy it is, it's a matter of if you can at all. Which would prove whether it's "pay to win" or not. Getting a better deal is not a convenience.

It's not about having the same level of anything? It's the fact that it's possible. Everything that A PREMIUM TAB CAN DO can be done without it. IS IT FAST AND IS IT EASY ISN'T THE POINT, it's that it's possible. Getting a better deal is a convenience that's why you pay auctioneers in real life to sell your stuff or why you get a real estate agent to sell your house.

I don't think you understand what the definition of "convenience" is, or an argument.
There isn't an argument to be made that just because you can do something, it's okay.

Involving little time or effort is what I think convenient means. Yes they made a free game that everyone even if they don't spend money on can enjoy and play. Someone that has a billion dollars invested isn't a better player nor will his gear reflect that he is. The only advantage that player has is that it's quicker for him to move things in and out of his inventory into his stash and trade items.

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Relationship a écrit :

Involving little time or effort is what I think convenient means. Yes they made a free game that everyone even if they don't spend money on can enjoy and play. Someone that has a billion dollars invested isn't a better player nor will his gear reflect that he is. The only advantage that player has is that it's quicker for him to move things in and out of his inventory into his stash and trade items.

I'm pretty sure the speed of moving things in and out an inventory is the same for everyone and so is trading. The difference is convenience in how those items are stored, and being able to store more.

One could argue even that aquisition is superior to premium tabs in many ways, but requires some getting used to.

Anyway, yet to hear an argument to validate this thread.

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johnKeys a écrit :

I like the colorful post @Super_Tree, but honestly - did you try actually playing with 4 tabs?
I have. for almost 3 years. maybe more. I'm old and senile.

i said i've played for 5 years, i've played since jan 20 2013, yes, i played until maybe a year ago before i supported for the first time, yes, i have played 4 tabs, it was somewhere in the essay. thats why i'm serious about my point and its not just a long bullshit essay with no point to back it up, experience is my entire point, and i'm asuming most of the whiners are people who have played it for a year with no actual interest in supporting the company to begin with and just see it as a F2P game.

sad some people dont understand in the end why i made this forum post in the first place but at least some people do thank u

let us think your intension was to get GGG to a point to make a post like, oh we really understand your trouble and because of it, we give all Players from beginning on more stash tabs than we have nowadays.
Don´t hope this would happen. You will be sad.

But for a player that is a beginner there are different aspects about stash than we have after playing the game for some time, because you will recognize that most of the uniques are so cheap to get by trade, it is not worth to hold every unique in stash.
With the end of league and events a lot of items will find their way to your standard stash. And because each league gives more new items, at some point you cannot longer hold everything in stash without paying really cheap 20 dollars for the game to have much more stash and with about 40 dollars in total you can have all extra stashes for currency etc and stash for trade.
But it depends on how much you want to trade to have need even for more stash.
I am not selling anything at all so all my stash is mine. When I buy for myself any item it is not a BIS item, it is a cheap price to have a special item with a buildenabling stat for small currency.
If you want to buy the big items, expensive ones the best in slot forever you cannot do this just by grinding currency, you will have to play a big trade simulation too.
But even with only 4 stash tabs, you can do all content, if you have long time to reach this goal.
I did not reach all content, but I am on my way to do it.
in total I have 12 stash tabs including currency divcards and essence, not more.
I hold the space for one inventory free at all time, so I can put all things I have at characters and put it back, when I want to play this character.
I need no mule accounts. And seriously 40 dollars for a game I am playing now for more than 2 years, it is okay for me. Started in Prophecy june 2016 and played nearly one year on 4 stash tabs.