Single target melee skills need damage tripled or quadrupled? maybe 100x?

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Pathological a écrit :

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Nephalim a écrit :

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Pathological a écrit :

The video is non-existent because the build is using slayer-retch, and has nothing to do with the skill. You're asking for a video that doesn't exist, and pretending it is proof positive of a fact that isn't what the video proves.

But you're right, comparing the retch to valirium is clearly relevant and not at all trolling.

A video of a non-melee build doing high level content quickly does not exist? LOL.

Valirium, oh that's funny. Keep telling yourself those high end ES builds use valirium and while pretending retch costs more than 3x it actually does.

There are plenty of videos of non-melee builds doing high content quickly; there are almost none that do it as fast as a retch build, because retch is fucking broken.

High end es builds don't use valirium, but they CAN, and low end versions exist. There is no option to replace the retch to make heavy strike viable.

In summary, life based slayer retch using static fucking strike is superior to nearly all other builds including the mighty CI+VP+GR+SF ranged builds.

Thank you, that's all I wanted to show from my initial post which seemed so confusing to you.
Here it is again.

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Nephalim a écrit :

Show me a ranged build or any build that clears as fast as slayer retch.

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Nephalim a écrit :

In summary, life based slayer retch using static fucking strike is superior to nearly all other builds including the mighty CI+VP+GR+SF ranged builds.

Thank you, that's all I wanted to show from my initial post which seemed so confusing to you.
Here it is again.

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Nephalim a écrit :

Show me a ranged build or any build that clears as fast as slayer retch.

Right... to which I replied "what the fuck does that have to do anything".

Which remains: nothing.

The builds that are superior to static strike life based slayer retch are: life based slayer retch using every single other non-dot skill gem that isn't a single target melee gem that exists in path of exile.

Glad we took four pages to clear that up. Back to your regularly scheduled programming.

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Pathological a écrit :

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Nephalim a écrit :

In summary, life based slayer retch using static fucking strike is superior to nearly all other builds including the mighty CI+VP+GR+SF ranged builds.

Thank you, that's all I wanted to show from my initial post which seemed so confusing to you.
Here it is again.

"

Nephalim a écrit :

Show me a ranged build or any build that clears as fast as slayer retch.

Right... to which I replied "what the fuck does that have to do anything".

Which remains: nothing.

The builds that are superior to static strike life based slayer retch are: life based slayer retch using every single other non-dot skill gem that isn't a single target melee gem that exists in path of exile.

Glad we took four pages to clear that up. Back to your regularly scheduled programming.

Did you even watch the videos? The clear times between ground slam/EQ/cyclone and SS are the same despite SS being obviously a single target skill.

Not to mention static strike itself is the best single target skill in his arsenal in addition to be on par with all other melee skills.

Maybe you'll start saying static strike, much like retch invalidates the build because its "OMFG BROKEN"?

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Nephalim a écrit :

Did you even watch the videos? The clear times between ground slam/EQ/cyclone and SS are the same despite SS being obviously a single target skill.

Not to mention static strike itself is the best single target skill in his arsenal in addition to be on par with all other melee skills.

Did you?

Here are the direct quotes from his thread:

The default is cyclone, it is the fastest clear and the biggest aoe dps. There is no direct quote from the creator.

Leap Slam
This is my primary variant. If your DPS is high enough, its clearspeed rivals that of Cyclone in the primary build. The key to making this variant work is 4-linking Herald of Ash with 1) iAOE 2) Ele Prolif and 3) Enlighten. With enough overkill, the burn is almost instant and covers your whole screen.

Static Strike
Ahh, Static Strike. The most underrated ability in the game. Even on non-Retch builds, nearly nothing else comes close to its 259% base damage. Add in the fact that we can now convert 100% of phys damage to lightning, and this is our single target king. Throw in some free aoe, and it makes a pretty decent map clearing gem too. This is my preferred single target ability these days, and I keep it on my swap weapon. It out performs even Conc Effect Cyclone, but of course makes you vulnerable to stun.

The other quotes basically imply he was just fucking around, but in the videos the clearspeeds are equal at worst, and all of those skills can be used from range, making them inherently safer as well as faster.

So yeah... static strike is the best single target. Woopee. I know when I am going for a top tier clear, the description I look for most is "pretty decent" .

It also requires you to run up to mobs, be in melee range of mobs, and stop to attack, whereas every other one of the skills can be used from range except for cyclone, which makes you stun immune.

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Pathological a écrit :

The other quotes basically imply he was just fucking around, but in the videos the clearspeeds are equal at worst, and all of those skills can be used from range, making them inherently safer as well as faster.

Static strike, a single target melee skill cleared as fast or nearly as fast as any other melee skill, while having the strongest single target.

I do not understand why it took you half a page of text to comprehend that.

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Nephalim a écrit :

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Pathological a écrit :

The other quotes basically imply he was just fucking around, but in the videos the clearspeeds are equal at worst, and all of those skills can be used from range, making them inherently safer as well as faster.

Static strike, a single target melee skill cleared as fast as any other melee skill, while having the strongest single target.

I do not understand why it took you half a page of text to comprehend that.

It didn't clear as fast, and required more risk to do what it did. Stop making shit up. The creator of the build doesn't use static strike to clear maps, he uses it for bosses.

Can we stop talking about the retch build, and start talking about the other 99.99999% of the time where the skills don't function? 4 pages is enough, we get it. You can brute force the skills into functioning with probably the most overpowered damage mechanic in the game.

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Pathological a écrit :

"

Nephalim a écrit :

"

Pathological a écrit :

The other quotes basically imply he was just fucking around, but in the videos the clearspeeds are equal at worst, and all of those skills can be used from range, making them inherently safer as well as faster.

Static strike, a single target melee skill cleared as fast as any other melee skill, while having the strongest single target.

I do not understand why it took you half a page of text to comprehend that.

It didn't clear as fast, and required more risk to do what it did. Stop making shit up. The creator of the build doesn't use static strike to clear maps, he uses it for bosses.

Can we stop talking about the retch build, and start talking about the other 99.99999% of the time where the skills don't function? 4 pages is enough, we get it. You can brute force the skills into functioning with probably the most overpowered damage mechanic in the game.

Stop making shit up? Did you even watch the video - was he intentionally doing slower runs on his non SS videos? It's funny how you cant provide video proof of anything yet dismiss video proof when its available.

It's a shame you think retch is the most overpowered thing in a game where most end game builds use CI+VP+GR+SF, the furthest thing from retch and yet you think the latter is not overpowered but the former is not a valid bases of comparison.

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Nephalim a écrit :

"

Pathological a écrit :

It didn't clear as fast, and required more risk to do what it did. Stop making shit up. The creator of the build doesn't use static strike to clear maps, he uses it for bosses.

Can we stop talking about the retch build, and start talking about the other 99.99999% of the time where the skills don't function? 4 pages is enough, we get it. You can brute force the skills into functioning with probably the most overpowered damage mechanic in the game.

Stop making shit up? Did you even watch the video - was he intentionally doing slower runs on his non SS videos? It's funny how you cant provide video proof of anything yet dismiss video proof when its available.

It's a shame you think retch is the most overpowered thing in a game where most end game builds use CI+VP+GR+SF, the furthest thing from retch and yet you think the latter is not overpowered but the former is not a valid bases of comparison.

The latter is definitely overpowered as well - the difference is that it is also extraordinarily more available and can be step-upped from lower tier gear, while the retch cannot. Single target melee skills are only viable at the extreme high end of gear, when their downside is overcome by extreme overabundant damage, which isn't necessary on other skills. Other skills are viable throughout the gamut of progression, because they are much more powerful by default and don't require that their damage be propped up by extreme mechanics.

You're seeing what you want to see with the videos. SS is not faster than the other skills, especially not cyclone and leap slam, which don't require you to stop moving to attack. In all other cases, clear speed is determined by attack speed and area.

Finally, static strike is one of many, many such skills. Even if I were to conceed that static strike was ok (and it is certainly in the mid-tier rather than the bottom feeders), it does nothing to help the viability of the other 10-12 abilities that aren't static strike.

Static strike clear time: 1:23
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x0imTr-NBI4

Leapslam clear time: 1:04
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aooA3neDhz8

cyclone clear time: 1:14
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aIU_Nblk6Fc

It is only marginally slower than cyclone and both were slower than leap slam which is a freaking melee movement ability. I wonder how fast it takes these 600 exalt ES builds with mirrored ranged weapons to clear a T16 map.

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The latter is definitely overpowered as well - the difference is that it is also extraordinarily more available and can be step-upped from lower tier gear, while the retch cannot. Single target melee skills are only viable at the extreme high end of gear, when their downside is overcome by extreme overabundant damage, which isn't necessary on other skills. Other skills are viable throughout the gamut of progression, because they are much more powerful by default and don't require that their damage be propped up by extreme mechanics.

Please show me end game ES gear progression on your characters. Have you ever even reached end game or done more than 2 T16 maps in your lifetime to make these assumptions? The burden to build an ES character is not that much easier than to build a retch character.

End game wise, there is clearly very little gap between melee, even single target melee and non melee as you have demonstrated by lack of evidence over and over.

It's becoming clear that you:
1) have little or no knowledge or experience of end game builds or progression
2) instantly bandwagon onto anything you deem as overpowered and broken
3) accept the sheep mentality on all matters without questioning or experimenting

I don't know if this was posted: "Edit3: I got permission to confirm that there are balance changes at the end of Breach, including big buffs to one-handed Melee, for example."

https://www.reddit.com/r/pathofexile/comments/5m9aql/path_of_exile_trailers_through_time_part_2/dc1ztxt/