Permanent Loot Allocation ... for .. why?

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Ten_of_Swords a écrit :

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thepmrc a écrit :

For many players (myself included), PA typically reduces drops not the other way around. I am not a slow looter. I played D2 for nearly 10 years and I have a great connection. I think your assumption of having stronger items due to PA is silly. Some people might benefit more from it than others, but in the end RNG controls your drops. .

Ok, so in SA or FFA some people are going to get more of the drops then others right? Because some people are faster etc. What about the others then? 50%+ WILL get less loot then if they play PA.

So what happens when these “chumps” realize they are too slow to paly SA effectively? They will go play PA. Then the bar is raised, again and again as the pool of chumps gets smaller and smaller. This is just one reason why these modes are not equivalent.

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thepmrc a écrit :

I am not going to argue that not having loot tension makes it more dangerous for a HC character, but I will argue that having PA does not decrease the game difficulty in any tangible fashion.

I already played 10 hours of PA in HC and it’s MUCH easier, and probably easier still if I could break my habits of constantly watching what falls and being close to the fight when I don’t need to be.

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thepmrc a écrit :

the fact that PA parties are much faster than SA parties

Awesome “Fact” and its light years from what I was seeing over the last several days playing both modes.

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thepmrc a écrit :

Really, saying that PA ups your chances for stronger drops is just ludicrous. FFA increases your chances for stronger drops because you have the potential to pick up every fucking item that dropped.

Again, your chances are stronger ONLY if you are the fastest person in the group. In any situation at the very least half the party IS ALWAYS getting less than in a PA group. I played FFA for several hours and got almost nothing, I do not consider myself slow. The guy hosting the party was insanely (looked like Picket from D2) fast. I would have just left the game but I stuck around just to see how things went.

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LostForm a écrit :

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thepmrc a écrit :

Well call me ignorant, blind, and/or misleading because that is a croc of shit.

Allocated loot doesn't help you get to max level. It doesn't cause people to start flipping items. To say that it does is ignorant, blind, and/or misleading....

it absolutely does help you get to max level, or are you going to argue that having no loot tension somehow makes the game more dangerous for hardcore characters or any character for that matter?
are you going to argue that having stronger items does not directly help your character reach max level? , and while allocation doesnt guarantee stronger items from drops, it does up your chances.
Please do, it could be entertaining.

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thepmrc a écrit :

As far as game difficulty goes. Did the monsters hit you harder in SA/FFA games? Did they have more HP? Did they have new abilities? If you turned off the loot entirely would it have been more difficult? The only thing that is more difficult is getting to drops, the game itself is not any more difficult.

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LostForm a écrit :

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thepmrc a écrit :

As far as game difficulty goes. Did the monsters hit you harder in SA/FFA games? Did they have more HP? Did they have new abilities? If you turned off the loot entirely would it have been more difficult? The only thing that is more difficult is getting to drops, the game itself is not any more difficult.

They absolutely do hit ranged characters harder in SA/FFA games, as the ranged players have to commit to the dog pile to get loot. How are you not seeing this? And yes, players had to deal with some mechanics to grab loot that they can safely ignore when the loot is promised to them anyways.

It is many orders of magnitude harder difficulty when you are playing the game for loot, and the loot is not reserved for you permanently when it drops. Absolutely, 100% harder.

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thepmrc a écrit :

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LostForm a écrit :

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thepmrc a écrit :

As far as game difficulty goes. Did the monsters hit you harder in SA/FFA games? Did they have more HP? Did they have new abilities? If you turned off the loot entirely would it have been more difficult? The only thing that is more difficult is getting to drops, the game itself is not any more difficult.

They absolutely do hit ranged characters harder in SA/FFA games, as the ranged players have to commit to the dog pile to get loot. How are you not seeing this? And yes, players had to deal with some mechanics to grab loot that they can safely ignore when the loot is promised to them anyways.

It is many orders of magnitude harder difficulty when you are playing the game for loot, and the loot is not reserved for you permanently when it drops. Absolutely, 100% harder.

Again, that is if you are dog piling on loot like flies on shit (the main reason people wanted loot options to begin with). If you are actively trying to reach max level I don't think that is where your priorities will be and it doesn't make the game any harder. It does make getting loot more difficult, but it does not tangibly change the game difficulty at all.

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Ten_of_Swords a écrit :

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thepmrc a écrit :

So essentially you don't want the 'chumps' to be able to opt out of the FFA/SA games and get some loot because this means that you get less loot?

Once they don’t have a way to “opt out to an easier mode” they will either work on improving their ability to loot within the timer of SA (not that impossible) or they will make some friends and agree to not compete for loot. Or any number of other solutions that both you and I followed when we were learning to play these kind of games.

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thepmrc a écrit :

As far as game difficulty goes. Did the monsters hit you harder in SA/FFA games? Did they have more HP? Did they have new abilities? If you turned off the loot entirely would it have been more difficult? The only thing that is more difficult is getting to drops, the game itself is not any more difficult.

Seriously? This is one of the most obvious things ever if you play the game at all. But okay, lets compare:

Here is how it works with SA: (short allocation mode)

-monsters die and drop loot.
-some monsters will drop something allocated to you for a few seconds.
-you must move up and get your loot in this time or others can take it. (You cannot just focus on safety or targeting or you will lose out)
-often when a monster dies it is in a place that’s dangerous, either surrounded by other monsters or at the “front lines” where range attackers will hit you.
-if you play often you will also know that taking positions in these more dangerous areas ahead of time also helps you get your share.
-sometimes you will lose some loot no matter how fast you are, so you will also need to be ready to get someone else’s loot if you are interested in getting your “fair” share.

Here is how it looks with PA:

-monsters die and drop loot.
-pick up loot after fight is over

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LostForm a écrit :

First off, the dog pile is the group of mobs, not players on a loot drop lol.

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LostForm a écrit :

Secondly, you have yet to show how the game is not easier with stronger gear.

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LostForm a écrit :

Thirdly, if picking up dropped loot is not the focus of play/does not help you succeed at the game, why do you even need guaranteed loot reserved for you, waiting for you until the melee guys control/kill everything?

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LostForm a écrit :

And finally, not having to put your character in harms way to pick up loot because the loot will guaranteed be there after the danger has passed very much decreases the difficulty of general party play. You trying to refute that fact is pretty amusing though.

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thepmrc a écrit :

Again, it makes picking up loot more difficult. It does not make the game more difficult. Be amused all you want, I will be satisfied with being correct.