No...the majority of players do not hate the game

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hboi#6131 a écrit :

Only 10 percent of people who enjoy a product will leave a positive review while 60 percent of people who do not enjoy a product will leave a negative review.

poe2 has been vastly more successful then poe1 ever was. there is a small minority of poe1 'vets' who want to see poe1.5 up in arms in the forums trying to blackmail the devs with their wallets to get what they want

Do you want to be friends ingame?

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Naharez#3496 a écrit :

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hboi#6131 a écrit :

Only 10 percent of people who enjoy a product will leave a positive review while 60 percent of people who do not enjoy a product will leave a negative review.

poe2 has been vastly more successful then poe1 ever was. there is a small minority of poe1 'vets' who want to see poe1.5 up in arms in the forums trying to blackmail the devs with their wallets to get what they want

Do you want to be friends ingame?

AAAAXAAAHAHAHHA OMG .... TOO FUNNY XD XD XD

"

DKBKB#3540 a écrit :

If you don't want to see those critical words and GGG is really doing well, then you should be able to find some people who share joy and praise GGG, which will also make me feel happy, but I really find it difficult to find such posts. I can't see the joy of the players.

To be fair, the game is obviously not all bad.
I'm not going to lie as far as I'm concerned I'm having a blast as far as the moment to moment gameplay is concerned.
It's just a personal opinion but I think people are maybe over-exagerating in some cases.
I was never really sure why people got so mad about the huntress gameplay to begin with, admittedly parry is a bit clunky and probably needs some tweaking but aside from that I was having a great time during the campain with my bleed ritualist
Some critism is absolutely warranted though, drop rates are too low (it's too difficult to progressively move on or accumulate wealth, you either get a lucky break and you can move on, or you don't and you stay in the same spot, potentially for hours) endgame is still pretty boring and crafting is just painful, lots of things are just way more tedious than they should be, etc.

I think there's just too many aspects of the game that became dissatisfactory enough that it reached the threshold for a lot of people to become fully negative.
It also doesn't help that ggg is being very conservative, even stubborn about changes to the VISION and that the addition of content is super slow.
It does seems like poe 2 is having a hard time finding its public at the moment, we're not really sure who this game is for.

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JakkerONAIR#4902 a écrit :

Again? Ok.

Reviews in the last 30 days: 17.601
Positive reviews in the last 30 days: 6.336 (36%)
Negative reviews in the last 30 days: 11.264 (64%)



Comparing the negative reviews from patch 0.2 to the current players doesn't work. One is just players, one is reviews.

Saying, "Look, only 11k negative reviews to 85k recent players" is a flawed connection. You don't know how many ppl gave a negative review and are still playing, you don't know how many ppl didn't give a negative review when they should have but didn't bother enough and so on. Like I said, these two datasets are not comparable.

The overall question of the discussion is:
"Is patch 0.2 good/bad, and is it responsible for the decline in player numbers?"

Furthermore, using the average of players is extremely misleading to push your biased narrative.
The only thing with weight to it is - how many came/left.

So, you look at datasets that are about the same thing - player numbers.

"Path of Exile 2: 0.1"
Month 1 - player peak of 578k and an avg of 304k
Month 2 - player peak of 353k and an avg of 190k
PoE2:0.1 had 61% (peak) and 63% (avg) remaining from m1 to m2.

Month 2 - player peak of 353k and an avg of 190k
Month 3 - player peak of 180k and an avg of 89k
PoE2:0.1 had 51% (peak) and 46% (avg) remaining from m2 to m3.

Month 3 - player peak of 180k and an avg of 89k
Month 4 - player peak of 72k and an avg of 30k
PoE2:0.1 had 40% (peak) and 33% (avg) remaining from m3 to m4.

Month 1 - player peak of 578k and an avg of 304k
Month 3 - player peak of 180k and an avg of 89k
PoE2:0.1 had 31% (peak) and 29% (avg) remaining from m1 to m3 (normal league circle).

"Path of Exile 2: 0.2"
Month 1 - player peak of 245k and an avg of 87k
Month 1 - player peak of 85k and an avg of 40k (recently and highly generous)
PoE2:0.2 had 34% (peak) and 46% (avg) remaining from week 1 to now.

Conclusion:
1) PoE patch 0.2 lost in 3-4 weeks a similar percentage of players than patch 0.2 in 3 months
2) The majority of ppl already left patch 0.2 (66% peak/54% avg)
3) The majority of 0.2 reviews are negative (64%)

I do commend the long respectful post so I'll do the same. I'll go paragraph by paragraph and break it down as well. I'll number them to keep it easier for myself and others to follow along.


1. It is not a "flawed connection" as you so put it. If you have 80k players currently playing and approx 15,000 of them left a negative review. You can deduce that approx 15% of them view the game negatively. I can literally do the same thing but a juxtaposed position. You don't know how many people left negative reviews at launch of Dawn of the hunt (first 3 days were the worst) and then changed their position. We cannot make assumptions but only look at the data. The data is clear that less then 20% of the total players of Dawn of the hunt left a negative review. Ether or, however you slice it, it is NOT the majority of players currently playing.

2. Using current active players is the only metric that can be verified. I can use similar logic (that you used) and ask similar questions. How many of the active players left for military service? died? got sick? got married? on vacation? there are thousands of questions you can ask yourself on why certain players no longer returned. Just because someone isn't coming back does not automatically mean they left because the game is bad. You are making an speculation on why they left or the reason the numbers went down and its your right. However, I don't deal in speculation but in just raw numbers or the current data set.

3. You used a lot of data points here and I cannot argue with the data set. However, the last couple data points are misleading as you are forgetting or didn't check that the average player count on the last data set is not 40k but 80k as bored out on steam (currently).Nor did you include the fact that during that decrease to 40k another ARPG game that had a ton of hype came out. You can see when LE came out there on steam and within days of its release the numbers started going back up. Which they are currently going back up on steam if you check today's charts.

With your conclusions I can see why you came to them and even though i disagree with your assertions and conclusion i can comment that you are being nuanced and reasonable about it. I have no qualms with you looking at the data set and saying what you believe. I just disagree cause I looked at the data and came to a different conclusion. All and all you came at it with class and dignity so that I tip my hat to you.

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hboi#6131 a écrit :

Only 10 percent of people who enjoy a product will leave a positive review while 60 percent of people who do not enjoy a product will leave a negative review.

poe2 has been vastly more successful then poe1 ever was. there is a small minority of poe1 'vets' who want to see poe1.5 up in arms in the forums trying to blackmail the devs with their wallets to get what they want

Poe 2 had a massive launch, but 0.2 had similar league start numbers than poe 1's settler's league and a weaker retention as well as a significant backlash, if there isn't some significant upturn in the next one, poe 2 will probably become less popular than poe 1 in the short term.

Angry people are louder, but it's pretty clear there's a lot of angry people at the moment, veterans and newbies too.

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LFA01#0120 a écrit :

"

hboi#6131 a écrit :

Only 10 percent of people who enjoy a product will leave a positive review while 60 percent of people who do not enjoy a product will leave a negative review.

poe2 has been vastly more successful then poe1 ever was. there is a small minority of poe1 'vets' who want to see poe1.5 up in arms in the forums trying to blackmail the devs with their wallets to get what they want

Poe 2 had a massive launch, but 0.2 had similar league start numbers than poe 1's settler's league and a weaker retention as well as a significant backlash, if there isn't some significant upturn in the next one, poe 2 will probably become less popular than poe 1 in the short term.

Angry people are louder, but it's pretty clear there's a lot of angry people at the moment, veterans and newbies too.

I count five people.

"

LFA01#0120 a écrit :

"

hboi#6131 a écrit :

Only 10 percent of people who enjoy a product will leave a positive review while 60 percent of people who do not enjoy a product will leave a negative review.

poe2 has been vastly more successful then poe1 ever was. there is a small minority of poe1 'vets' who want to see poe1.5 up in arms in the forums trying to blackmail the devs with their wallets to get what they want

Poe 2 had a massive launch, but 0.2 had similar league start numbers than poe 1's settler's league and a weaker retention as well as a significant backlash, if there isn't some significant upturn in the next one, poe 2 will probably become less popular than poe 1 in the short term.

Angry people are louder, but it's pretty clear there's a lot of angry people at the moment, veterans and newbies too.

No this poe2 league has had similar numbers to THE BEST LEAGUE POE1 EVER HAD. It does not have similar numbers to the past leagues that did not do well or did mediocre.

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hboi#6131 a écrit :

Only 10 percent of people who enjoy a product will leave a positive review while 60 percent of people who do not enjoy a product will leave a negative review.

poe2 has been vastly more successful then poe1 ever was. there is a small minority of poe1 'vets' who want to see poe1.5 up in arms in the forums trying to blackmail the devs with their wallets to get what they want

Once you start comparing the POE 1 numbers to POE 2 numbers it makes a even clearer picture. I also find it funny that on average, 80-120k players played any given league and the game was a "success" and a "hit" but when POE 2 hits the numbers the same people will scream the game is dead and look at the numbers.


POE 2 put up numbers that POE 1 in 10 years never ever came close to.

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LFA01#0120 a écrit :

"

DKBKB#3540 a écrit :

If you don't want to see those critical words and GGG is really doing well, then you should be able to find some people who share joy and praise GGG, which will also make me feel happy, but I really find it difficult to find such posts. I can't see the joy of the players.

To be fair, the game is obviously not all bad.
I'm not going to lie as far as I'm concerned I'm having a blast as far as the moment to moment gameplay is concerned.
It's just a personal opinion but I think people are maybe over-exagerating in some cases.
I was never really sure why people got so mad about the huntress gameplay to begin with, admittedly parry is a bit clunky and probably needs some tweaking but aside from that I was having a great time during the campain with my bleed ritualist
Some critism is absolutely warranted though, drop rates are too low (it's too difficult to progressively move on or accumulate wealth, you either get a lucky break and you can move on, or you don't and you stay in the same spot, potentially for hours) endgame is still pretty boring and crafting is just painful, lots of things are just way more tedious than they should be, etc.

I think there's just too many aspects of the game that became dissatisfactory enough that it reached the threshold for a lot of people to become fully negative.
It also doesn't help that ggg is being very conservative, even stubborn about changes to the VISION and that the addition of content is super slow.
It does seems like poe 2 is having a hard time finding its public at the moment, we're not really sure who this game is for.

Haha, I'm preparing to change my Lich Summoner and make her a Blood Mage

"

Naharez#3496 a écrit :

75% of reviews in total are positive. Player retention is better than in most other comparable games.

Current negativity probably a form of political movement.

Dude... you can't preach "be scientific" and then say conspiracy stuff...

Yes. The majority of reviews are positive, BUT the majority of reviews were in the first two months of patch 0.1.
Patch 0.1 is not the topic of the discussion; it's about THIS version of the game (0.2).

The amount of positive reviews from the start of Early Access is meaningless for the discussion because back then, the game was in another state than it is now.

It's nonsensical to say "the overall numbers" when the overall numbers don't reflect the recent state of the game.

Imagine the newest PoE1 league would get 65% negative reviews, but you argue, "Nyo, at another point in time, when it was another version of the game, the reviews were better!".
Nobody will care how it WAS, ppl care how it IS.