Chaos recipe nerf only fixed a symptom

I will start this off with some statistics for you guys, and then i will get to my point.
For you people that dont know, i am using about 2-5 chaos per higher level map (74+) and also 4 chisels.
I think im on the lower spectrum regarding the amount of currencies used on higher level maps, i know that other people are exalting them.
If you dont put in a certain amount of currencies, you are back to doing lower level maps.
Clearing a map takes about 10 minutes.

In the last patch, i would do vaal normal runs with 5 dummy accounts that i would manually put into vaal´s room, kill the boos, loot the rares, and create chaos orbs with the recipe.
With 127% quantity and 289% rarity, i was able to create about 10-20 chaos orbs per hour (depending on how lucky i got).
Farming vaal for 2-3 hours, would allow me to do 1-2 hours worth of maps.

This patch the chaos recipe was nerfed, so i tried farming on higher level content today.
I farmed 7 hours on act 3 merciless with 127% quantity and 289% rarity.
I got a total of 4 chaos orbs, and was able to create 2 more through the recipe.
I basically got 6 chaos orbs for 7 hours worth of farm time.
I was able to do a single higher level map with it.

So where am i going with this you ask? Hear me out a second.
The chaos recipe nerf did not fix the actual problem, but only a symptom.
The problem is, that higher level content, if you are doing it solo, does not drop a reasonable amount of currencies, with which you could do high level maps.
You have to invest a lot of time in order to get the amount of currency that you need to be able to roll higher level maps with.
Farming 7 hours for 10 minutes worth of map time, isn´t even remotely close to reasonable.
So what is the symptom of this problem you ask?
The symptom was (in the last patch), that higher level players (and groups of people) felt forced to create 5 alternate accoutns with which they would increase lower level contents´ loot amount, by putting these dummy players into the map zone.
The chaos recipe nerf fixed this symptom for lower levels.
The problem has not been fixed however.

Now i feel forced to level these 5 alternate accounts through the 3 difficulties in order to get them to merciless, in order to put them into my act 3 farm zones, because they dont drop anything if you do them alone.
The problem has not been fixed, the symptom was attempted to be fixed, but instead a similar (even worse) symptom has emerged: you have to pull these dummy accounts to higher level content, narrowing down the amount of people that can be arsed do this even further.

I am not going to farm solo and gain less loot, if i can just put in 5 alternate accounts and pretty much still 1 shot everything, im just not.
I know that several other high level characters are doing this (and have been doing this for a long time) and i will also switch to this method, because farming act 3 for 7 hours in order to be able to do a 10 minute map run, is not appealing to me.

The actual problem needs to be fixed, not the symptom.

% players /6

/thread

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Courageous a écrit :

% players /6

/thread

Pretty much this.

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gh0un a écrit :

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Courageous a écrit :

% players /6

/thread

Pretty much this.

Do you actually notice an increase in drop rate from chiseling maps?

In my experience thus far it seems they have a negative impact. Out of 20 maps, all fully chiseled up and rolled rare I found 1 single map. On an average blue map (good mods) with no chisels used I get about 1.2-1.5 maps. Was this simply a horrible RNG streak? I decided after that session last night that I will never use another chisel as they seem to drastically reduce map drop rates.

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thepmrc a écrit :

Do you actually notice an increase in drop rate from chiseling maps?

In my experience thus far it seems they have a negative impact. Out of 20 maps, all fully chiseled up and rolled rare I found 1 single map. On an average blue map (good mods) with no chisels used I get about 1.2-1.5 maps. Was this simply a horrible RNG streak? I decided after that session last night that I will never use another chisel as they seem to drastically reduce map drop rates.

I havent had much time to even get rollin on maps since CB, but i honestly never noticed a whole lot of difference in maps as far as drop rates go, as i did the mob mods. The mobs very obviously changed, the loot, meh, not so much.

Of course, my total lifetime map running is prolly a hella lot less than some around here, so who knows. Factor that in with RNG, heh.

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JoannaDark a écrit :

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thepmrc a écrit :

Do you actually notice an increase in drop rate from chiseling maps?

In my experience thus far it seems they have a negative impact. Out of 20 maps, all fully chiseled up and rolled rare I found 1 single map. On an average blue map (good mods) with no chisels used I get about 1.2-1.5 maps. Was this simply a horrible RNG streak? I decided after that session last night that I will never use another chisel as they seem to drastically reduce map drop rates.

I havent had much time to even get rollin on maps since CB, but i honestly never noticed a whole lot of difference in maps as far as drop rates go, as i did the mob mods. The mobs very obviously changed, the loot, meh, not so much.

Of course, my total lifetime map running is prolly a hella lot less than some around here, so who knows. Factor that in with RNG, heh.

I have probably ran 500+ maps just since OB. Ran up into the 70s a few times, currently have a large map supply with only one 70 map and probably 40 or so 69 and under. I recently purchased hundred or so chisels, used on my highest level maps, rolled them all rare with huge quantity/pack size, and ended up getting 1 map out of ALL of them combined. Honestly it feels as though I would have had better luck running them as plain white maps with no quality.

Been saying this problem/symptom thing for some time now... since multiboxing came into public light.

Anyway, this thing with levelling up 5 alts to Merciless is just excessive. Wouldn't do it for a mountain of exalts.

I'd really like to hear from Chris, how much grinding is OK in his opinion? Then, how much grinding is OK to be able to grind the endgame?

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Undon3 a écrit :

Anyway, this thing with levelling up 5 alts to Merciless is just excessive. Wouldn't do it for a mountain of exalts.

Its not excessive, its necessary if you want to be able to continue leveling at a good pace.
Two lvl 66 map grant less than 1% experience to me, while a lvl 72 one grants 5-10%.
Higher level maps still grant a lot of experience and the only way to get them is to pump a lot of chaos orbs into the map system.

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gh0un a écrit :

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Undon3 a écrit :

Anyway, this thing with levelling up 5 alts to Merciless is just excessive. Wouldn't do it for a mountain of exalts.

Its not excessive, its necessary if you want to be able to continue leveling at a good pace.
Two lvl 66 map grant less than 1% experience to me, while a lvl 72 one grants 5-10%.
Higher level maps still grant a lot of experience and the only way to get them is to pump a lot of chaos orbs into the map system.

Yeah, I totally understand what you meant, I'm in the same situation with the 66-67 maps. The 69s I ran today barely gave me 4%/map in average. That's why I mentioned the mountain of exalts and my curiosity regarding what views Chris holds on this issues. Because at one point, maybe it's just not worth the effort any more - when you have to take all kinds of parallel paths just to remain in the only part of the game that is profitable at your level.

BTW, I think that you should NOT get free access to endgame content, I mean, it should be unlocked somehow, but after unlocking it and going through some whatever grind you went, it should stay the hell unlocked.