Sooo, when will Immortal Call become a warcry?

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raics a écrit :

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caboom a écrit :

i will rather see a rework of CWDT, other than the automatization of molten shell/curses and may be some fun build with loop ring there is no real reason to use it.

replace damage penalty with less duration and the gem would probably work a bit better

If we go that way I'd go for 'less skill effect' if at all possible. So, less damage for spells, less curse effect for curses and so on. I suppose it would work similar to 'flask effect', some effects can be scaled but for those that can't (like IC) it would scale duration.

If you ask me, a level 1 CwDT should be something nobody would consider using at high levels.

why insist on lowering the damage of linked spells? geting yourself beaten to a pulp is enought of a drawback if you ask me. people fear another cast on crit but lets get real, how many builds you know that can take over 3k dmg every 250 ms to make the most out of this gem?

@raics

I see what your goal is here, but no matter what you think of immortal call, it doesn't fit to be a warcry.


The second issue is GGG hasn't done really anything to improve the gap of survability with the left side (armor) and the rest of the tree in terms of physical mitigation. I think ranged characters like bow builds can mitigate enough and hopefully get enough life to deal with the hits they do take, but since the removal of the flat reduction from AA and the change to not be a mana regen based defensive option its overall pretty lacking of a thing to use for various spell casters and such. The basalt flask def helped these sorts of builds find a way to deal with physical damage, but its not "reliable" in the sense that you can't always be sure its up, unless your pathfinder or ranger and have a good number of the flask nodes.

I want to agree with you that it would force GGG to reconsider the situation, but it won't, if you look back historically just removing a defensive option doesn't create more opportunities, it actually just limits them.


However, there IS an opportunity here that hasn't really been discussed, if immortal call was changed to immortal cry, there is an opportunity to introduce a solution to melee style builds that build around endurance charges that suffer from taking additional damage, fortify sorta helps, but it still is out of wack for elemental damage IMO. So what if immortal cry made you immortal to physical damage and helped further reduce elemental damage, somehow making it scale in such a way that if you have more then the 3 default endurance charges it last long enough to be useful and something you can use to react to a threat, because if you have endurance charges on the tree you have duration and can get around the whole cant cast 2 warcry thing.

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caboom a écrit :

why insist on lowering the damage of linked spells? geting yourself beaten to a pulp is enought of a drawback if you ask me. people fear another cast on crit but lets get real, how many builds you know that can take over 3k dmg every 250 ms to make the most out of this gem?

One of those 30k ES build probably, you could easily have 3 or 4 CwDT setups with 2-3 spells each, that's a lot of power. However, I agree there's a problem with the concept, sometimes enemies just don't hit you fast enough or use DoT so reactive builds are kinda unreliable without selfdamage mechanics and don't fit the current 'kill them before they can blink' meta. Unfortunately, we do have such available and perpetual casters are already pretty strong so that would need to be nipped in the bud too.

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goetzjam a écrit :

However, there IS an opportunity here that hasn't really been discussed, if immortal call was changed to immortal cry, there is an opportunity to introduce a solution to melee style builds that build around endurance charges that suffer from taking additional damage, fortify sorta helps, but it still is out of wack for elemental damage IMO. So what if immortal cry made you immortal to physical damage and helped further reduce elemental damage, somehow making it scale in such a way that if you have more then the 3 default endurance charges it last long enough to be useful and something you can use to react to a threat, because if you have endurance charges on the tree you have duration and can get around the whole cant cast 2 warcry thing.

Sure, we did mention getting a few good, reliable sources of charges would help a bunch, there are tons of possibilities. I'm personally partial to timed mechanics, something like 'gain an endurance charge for every 1s you spend within x distance from an enemy' and I'd really like to see immortal call as a dominantly melee option.

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raics a écrit :

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caboom a écrit :

why insist on lowering the damage of linked spells? geting yourself beaten to a pulp is enought of a drawback if you ask me. people fear another cast on crit but lets get real, how many builds you know that can take over 3k dmg every 250 ms to make the most out of this gem?

One of those 30k ES build probably, you could easily have 3 or 4 CwDT setups with 2-3 spells each, that's a lot of power. However, I agree there's a problem with the concept, sometimes enemies just don't hit you fast enough or use DoT so reactive builds are kinda unreliable without selfdamage mechanics and don't fit the current 'kill them before they can blink' meta. Unfortunately, we do have such available and perpetual casters are already pretty strong so that would need to be nipped in the bud too.

30k ES sounds like it has no damage at all or is one of those chars with super GG items wich bring back the point that even with the damage boost it wont surpass cast on crit in terms of clear speed.

may be i am missing something but i took a look to those perpetual casters and they are more a nich fun build than an actual strong build.

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caboom a écrit :

may be i am missing something but i took a look to those perpetual casters and they are more a nich fun build than an actual strong build.

Well, in the current meta anything that doesn't do instant vaporization isn't considered strong, our standards seem to be in sore need of adjustment :)
Looks like a solid niche to me, but it might spin out of control, well, that shouldn't be a problem to adjust even if it does, it's minor issue.

What I'd like to see with CwDT is using percentages instead, every 20% of your life/ES total or something and have it only gain skill effectiveness with levelling.