watching Streamers do the Hardcore one-month, made me realize something

A good player doesn't have to encounter all bosses or dangerous mob packs. For me, a good player knows when to go in or not!

"

_Ryu a écrit :

A good player doesn't have to encounter all bosses or dangerous mob packs. For me, a good player knows when to go in or not!

to me, a good player doesn't cower away from a fight, nor does he cheese it with exploits.

it is completely acceptable to run away and TP out in order to refill flasks, rethink strategy, maybe change gear/gem-setup for the kind of fight you just got yourself into - but then you go right back in and
kick. some. ass!

logouts? TP out and log-out/instance-switch? abusing grace periods instead of helping your party members take down the nasty sonofabitch? that's not acceptable.

play the damn game!

They should do it as it's done in Torchlight 2. You can exit, but next time you start the game, you are right in the same position as before. :-)

"

Filousov a écrit :

They should do it as it's done in Torchlight 2. You can exit, but next time you start the game, you are right in the same position as before. :-)

works only in Single Player.
if you joined a Multiplayer Game, TL2 doesn't save your position. you'll just start off in the nearest town when you log back in, just like PoE does it.

as for what I think about that save mechanism in TL2... I had a short power outage once, and it cost me an HC death immediately when I went back in a few minutes later.
that was heart-breaking because it was a good character. almost as good as the one I earned "Unstoppable" with.

that, is precisely why I disagree with all the people saying "altf4 should be punished". there's absolutely no way to do that, without punishing god knows how many "legitimate" players.

but again, the game should not be balanced assuming altf4 is a legitimate playing tactic - because then you get all this one-shot bullcrap which pisses me off, and an excuse to not do a damn thing about desync "because you can always log out".

"

johnKeys a écrit :

that, is precisely why I disagree with all the people saying "altf4 should be punished". there's absolutely no way to do that, without punishing god knows how many "legitimate" players.
but again, the game should not be balanced assuming altf4 is a legitimate playing tactic - because then you get all this one-shot bullcrap which pisses me off.

Unfortunately, you can't really have it both ways. If players can log out "instantly" to purposefully avoid death - by which I actually mean as fast as human reaction time will allow - then the only thing which will kill such dedicated exploiters is damage which also occurs "instantly."

The only alternative to balancing around Alt+F4 is imbalancing around it.

But we've already had this conversation.

I still feel for folks with legitimate connection issues, so I believe very firmly that such a delay should be minimal, as stated earlier in this thread. But even a 1 second AltF4/logout delay would be a huge improvement over the current situation, essentially giving the game one extra second over which to spread out its spike damage and give players more reasonable means to react.

When i was playing earlier today i logged out from a hairy situation. Feels good

"

ScrotieMcB a écrit :

I still feel for folks with legitimate connection issues, so I believe very firmly that such a delay should be minimal, as stated earlier in this thread. But even a 1 second AltF4/logout delay would be a huge improvement over the current situation, essentially giving the game one extra second over which to spread out its spike damage and give players more reasonable means to react.

good point. especially the bold part.

Thanks john. It also shows why a huge delay is unnecessary: if you (implicitly) want to spread the current spike damage out over an additional 5+ seconds, you're (implicitly) asking far too slow of a pace of play.

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Odoakar a écrit :

The game is designed around the ability to alt+f4.

Laughing.

My.

FUCKING.

Ass off.

For SO many reasons.

More thoughts on AltF4/logout delay length:

800ms - probably sufficient to discorage its use at current game speeds. However, it is very reasonable to believe the current pace of play is too fast, made unnaturally so in an attempt to kill AltF4/logout users before they could react.

1000ms - probably enough to discorage AltF4/logout abuse even while slowing the pace of play roughly 20%. (Pace of play is complicated, but let's just say both players and monsters had 20% less DPS, and you get a rough idea. This would be the same as 25% more EHP for both.)

1200ms - as above, but allows for up to 33% slower pace of play. (Feels like 50% more EHP for both.)

1500ms - Up to 46% slower pace of play. (Feels like 87% more EHP for both.)

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It seems to me that a AltF4/logout delay of either 1000ms or 1200ms best fits the situation. Even a 1.5 second delay would probably be overkill, because it's unlikely we'd want to slow down the pace of play more than 30%, so that large of a delay would probably just unduly punish players with connection issues.