Cast on Crit Really NEEDs a Nerf (Who Loves CoC k?)

Cast on Crit isn't overpowered. It does, however, create visually stunning (and sometimes graphics-card disabling) explosions. Whenever you have a skill which causes many explosions per second — regardless of what else is going on — you are going to end up with a legion of jelly haters.

CoC is powerful and useful, and popular as a result. But it's not overpowered, it's simply powered. It needs no nerf.

For all of you that think CoC is powerful, look at all of the builds that can get 50+k DPS.

There is a build that uses crit and Bino's Kitchen Knife and basically one-shots enemies if it scores a critical hit. CoC can't do that.

Dischargers can one-shot mobs, without crit.

Flameblast can one-shot mobs, without crit.

There are plenty of things that can do more than CoC, but not visually.

Things like thorns and CB don't just counter CoC, they counter anything that delivers a ton of hits. Those other builds are at the unfortunate disadvantage of not doing over 50k+ AoE DPS per second. Also: staunching flasks, topaz flasks/a purity aura, etc, all ways to counter a lot of the listed CoC downsides.

I also feel the "But reflect!" argument is incredibly dumb. Basic situational awareness and picking skills that don't obliterate offscreen targets (+ having an alt skill fo reflect) are pretty hard counters to ele reflect, nevermind other forms of negation. If somethings strong enough that "I kill things offscreen too quickly" becomes it's limiting factor, it should probably at least be looked at.

Personally, any time I party with a CoC player, I kind of want to stop playing the game. Not because my graphics card has a stroke, but because it's such a dumb, cheap, diversity-killing way to pay. While I'm off in a corner trying to make some manual casting life/ES hybrid work, a CoC can just yolo-swaggins their way through 95% of the games content. I'd much rather play a game where I went "Oh, cool! I didn't think of combining _____ with ____!", instead of "Well, I guess me and the other 4 people in this party will sit back while Mr.CoC solos everything".

On that note, I wouldn't care as much as I do if things like manual casting (and more broadly, things like staves, life/ES hybrids, etc) didn't suck so hard.

As to whether or not it should actually be nerfed: I think it's fair to say it's a really obvious break from the norm in terms of power and "visual design", and that break leads to people like me whining about it being too powerful. I think power difference between CoC and non-CoC skills need to be eliminated, whether that means nerfing CoC, buffing everything else, or at least introducing alternatives. I suspect GGG's actual approach will be some blend of the three.

i see two possibilities:
put it on a cooldown
make it trigger only one skill per proc (great EE!)

I'd like that for once someone who played CoC complained about it.
So many talking out of their ass I wont even start quoting, everybody knows who.

Never seen any build RIP itself as fast as CoC does. Offscreen ele ref? oops 2dead4u.
CB? depends on the mob, hit a bad one and I hope you have your fingers on a logout macro and the reaction speed to do it (Protip: you wont).
Thorns? a bit safer if you play smart since the mobs dont seem to cast it until they see you, still have seen people RIP due to a bad timing with mob casting it and their attack starting and team mates triggering thorns off-screen due to spreading out in team.

Enfeeble, temp chains, silence and blind is bad news, especially considering that CoC defense is its offense..
Outside of double ungils ST its not exactly cheap and please do not bring standard economy logic into it.
I am not against a nerf, but a reasonable one, not these absolutely ridiculous ones that you are suggesting, which are nothing but a "it kills my pc, nerf it to the ground plz so that no one will ever use it again".

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Disrupted a écrit :

I'd like that for once someone who played CoC complained about it.

Those that build it correctly don't complain because they like it.

Those that can't get it to work or have trouble playing it complain about it and get help. Then then become the above.

Those that just hate it and don't want anything to do with it except destroy it complain about it.

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Disrupted a écrit :

Never seen any build RIP itself as fast as CoC does.

...and yet everyone complains about CoC being overpowered and this and that.

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Disrupted a écrit :

CB? depends on the mob, hit a bad one and I hope you have your fingers on a logout macro and the reaction speed to do it (Protip: you wont).

Logout macro won't help you. Having a full belt of anti-bleed flasks will.

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Disrupted a écrit :

Enfeeble, temp chains, silence and blind is bad news, especially considering that CoC defense is its offense..

Yep. Yet everyone that wants CoC either removed or nerfed won't acknowledge this.

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Disrupted a écrit :

I am not against a nerf, but a reasonable one, not these absolutely ridiculous ones that you are suggesting, which are nothing but a "it kills my pc, nerf it to the ground plz so that no one will ever use it again".

That's the only reason they want to nerf it.

Um Natharius, Everyone has acknowledged that you said enfeeble and temp chains destroy CoCk. We just read it, and laugh because you can say that about any build lol.

Also I can't believe your still going on saying that Cast on Critical is perfect the way it is. You are just being arrogant and thickheaded, and most likely you play CoCk yourself, go try a normal build where you have to try and do 25k dps.

People complain about using Aegis with Max Block saying how cheap it is. Dude that build has nothing on CoCk. Even with max block, your barely pushing 15k dps unbuffed.

We need to think of better ways to balance it out, I like some of the suggestions i have seen on here though.

I love Cast on Crit :(

I love when my full screen have effects and my party members crash/die. Because i personnaly have no lags.

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levy42088 a écrit :

Um Natharius, Everyone has acknowledged that you said enfeeble and temp chains destroy CoCk. We just read it, and laugh because you can say that about any build lol.

Also I can't believe your still going on saying that Cast on Critical is perfect the way it is. You are just being arrogant and thickheaded, and most likely you play CoCk yourself, go try a normal build where you have to try and do 25k dps.

People complain about using Aegis with Max Block saying how cheap it is. Dude that build has nothing on CoCk. Even with max block, your barely pushing 15k dps unbuffed.

We need to think of better ways to balance it out, I like some of the suggestions i have seen on here though.

So Enfeeble and Temporal Chains destroy everything? I wonder how people play maps with those mods, then.

RT isn't destroyed by either.

Summoners aren't destroyed by either.

If you want "thickheaded", look at yourself. Aegis builds can practically run any map. CoC can't.

I just want the mana cost on the spells getting cast to have an effect on the mana cost of the attack.
I don't think it is fair that higher level spells and supported spells don't increase the cost.
You can theoretically do something like barrage + coc + firestorm + stormcall + increased area + conc effect.
If you use a level 1 barrage you can pay a tiny amount of mana to spam two level 20 spells with two supports.
For me it just breaks the whole point of having spells have costs.

Cast when damage taken, cast on stun, cast on death you are exchanging a bad thing happening for the spell to cast.
Curse on hit I'm fine with, sockets are at a premium so if you want to use two extra sockets to get past the curse mana cost go for it.
Cast on melee kill.... Lol I wish I could make this worth using outside of silly Vaal cyclone setups. Even stronger than curse on hit with the socket opportunity cost.
But cast on crit... Crits are what you want to happen!
And you can use projectile attacks, which generally have way more support type overlap with spells than melee skills do.
There is just too little cost for the benefit provided.