How to fix the whole Righteous Fire problem

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raics a écrit :

I like the suggestion generally but don't like the 'need ES to burn part'. I'd make it "You burn for 100% of your ES or life per second and stop at 1 life".

So some 3000 life, 100 ES character would be able to keep Righteous Fire up forever with no life regen nodes whatsoever, just a Vitality aura? That would be ultra-abusable.

If it's based off ES, it needs to stop at zero ES. And I couldn't give a rat's ass about reviving life-based RF; what I am concerned about is making RF a usable skill even for characters who cannot sustain it indefinitely. The way to do that is to ensure that using the skill without sustainability doesn't outright kill you — therefore, stopping at zero ES.

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ScrotieMcB a écrit :

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raics a écrit :

I like the suggestion generally but don't like the 'need ES to burn part'. I'd make it "You burn for 100% of your ES or life per second and stop at 1 life".

So some 3000 life, 100 ES character would be able to keep Righteous Fire up forever with no life regen nodes whatsoever, just a Vitality aura? That would be ultra-abusable.

If it's based off ES, it needs to stop at zero ES. And I couldn't give a rat's ass about reviving life-based RF; what I am concerned about is making RF a usable skill even for characters who cannot sustain it indefinitely. The way to do that is to ensure that using the skill without sustainability doesn't outright kill you — therefore, stopping at zero ES.

No, man, I ain't really that dumb. What I meant to say is while it burns your ES, it's based on max ES. While it burns life, it's based on max life. Probably would be a bit hard to implement since it would have to switch damage it does to enemies too when it makes the transition. Or maybe just make it burn for 100% of Life + ES, that would be easy to implement and would leave absolutely no room for exploit.

Also, I'm all for basing elemental effects on some percentage of ES, it's idiotic to include it just on some uniques, just make your damn mind whether that should be the way things work or not. Uniques shouldn't bypass base game mechanics, just look at Shavs and Soul.

Not sure why draining ES would make sense. Also that doesn't fit the theme of righteous fire.

The simple solution is RF drains life and mana. IE 100% of max life per second in fire damage and drains, say, 25% of maximum mana per second. The entire point of RF is you put yourself in danger for a short time in order to deal more damage. The problem is when there is no longer any danger and you can have it on permanently. The second problem is how easy it is to do this.

If you build around it, I think it is fair that you can remove the danger from using RF (ie low life builds barely take damage from it) but having it on permanently is completely broken.

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BigRussianDude a écrit :

Not sure why draining ES would make sense. Also that doesn't fit the theme of righteous fire.

The simple solution is RF drains life and mana. IE 100% of max life per second in fire damage and drains, say, 25% of maximum mana per second.

So you think the theme of Righteous Fire is... what, exactly?

I was under the impression that RF was supposed to be a short-term, non-permanent spell damage boost which puts you in slightly more danger.

So obviously, what you think is thematically appropriate is to make it so that, during this short-term, non-permanent boost, the caster's mana pool is rapidly drained, making it impossible for them to cast spells.

Brilliant.

rf and shavs are not the problem, springleaf is

too easy to get badass regen as lowlife. we need regen items with "does not work with low life" mod

Sigh... just create a freaking item that converts ignite damage to mana drain. Problem solved... nothing to see here folks... problem solved.

how about basing the burning dmg ES or Life depending on which one is higher
a LL build with 100 (75 of it is reserved with auras) and 400 ES would take burning dmg based ES
a lifebased build 300 life would burn for life

and a lifebased build with some es i.e. 250life and 100 ES would still take burning dmg based on life as long as he doesnt reserve enough life to make it lower than his es

So basically you're making it so that you are a full-life build instead of low-life. If you've got no ES, then it burns you for nothing, and you take no damage. Way to go with the solution.

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raics a écrit :

What I meant to say is while it burns your ES, it's based on max ES. While it burns life, it's based on max life. Probably would be a bit hard to implement since it would have to switch damage it does to enemies too when it makes the transition.

Or maybe just make it burn for 100% of Life + ES, that would be easy to implement and would leave absolutely no room for exploit.

Hmm, I'm gonna quote myself as I gave it some more thought. The first solution would make you burn your whole health+es reserve in 2 seconds with no resists, while the second one would do it in 1s, just like when using regular life RF build.
Now, some may say the first might be unbalanced. Why, if armor and evasion can't protect you from RF why would ES be able to? Then again, RF is supposed to be a caster boost so that kinda makes sense too.

And, as Scrotie pointed out, RF was supposed to be a short-term caster boost and it royally failed that. It would most probably benefit from rework, but what kind of rework?
Let's see my two brain hemispheres trying to brainstorm it...
(* is right side, the creative one 'the dreamer', # is left side, the analytical one 'the party pooper')

* It might anchor you in place, rename it to 'fossile fuel' or something?
# Plain bad name. Besides, casters don't move much anyway, if they use zombies or totems they might not move at all for the whole fight, it would give party caster a clear advantage too.

* How about draining resistance, renamed to maybe 'adaptive overload'?
# Sounds like a bad sci-fi movie. But that holds a possibility, it might convert resists to magic power by rate of 2:1, you might also tune it based on how much resists are you willing to sacrifice by levelling the gem. Let's say it would drain 50% of your resists giving you 25% more spell damage and drain 100% at level 20 giving you a 50% more boost. Sounds interesting to me, resists are important.

* Maybe halting mana regen and mana drain, I got a bit carried away with renaming, but how does 'redirect power' sound?
# Hmm, a bit cheesy to be honest. Anyway, that means you could gain a boost relative to your mana regen and possibly boost it further with mana drain until you spend all your mana and the spell ends. Actually sounds balanced and would mean one more use for eldritch battery, you're a genius rightey!
* Hehe, it happens sometimes.

I saw a top player on stream using RF, it works quite OP when you have an unique item which makes you take no fire damage at all, but its a bit too much for unluck players to earn that unique (i don't even remember its name).

Yes, RF is broken as it forces you to always use a too specific uniques for use its benefits, maybe if damage on caster become chaos/physical/life removal (prevent fire imunnity from stop it) AND if damage rate become slower (100% of max life per second is too much to deal with, it should be at most 40%), even though it nerfs damage output (at most 20% of max life per second instead of 50%), then RF would be not broken that much, as cheaper equiped characters may now deal with damage taken.

Somehow, pls fix RF.