Can we talk about Leech IMMUNITY?

Why are immunities on (red) maps ok? Because they don't fucking drop lolroflmaostompcopter)@^$^$_^#^#+^%_(

But seriously, classic numbers game.

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Aim_Deep a écrit :

lol a lot of us asked for hard and GGG went whole hog. Good thing we dont have to worry about it though since high maps dont drop anyway

The issue here is... some mods simply aren't hard, they just make the map impossible.

If you get Bloodmagic on a CI char you simply cannot do the map, it isn't getting any harder.

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Emphasy a écrit :

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Aim_Deep a écrit :

lol a lot of us asked for hard and GGG went whole hog. Good thing we dont have to worry about it though since high maps dont drop anyway

The issue here is... some mods simply aren't hard, they just make the map impossible.

If you get Bloodmagic on a CI char you simply cannot do the map, it isn't getting any harder.

I don't see that being an issue of any sort. Not all builds are supposed to be able to clear all content in the game.

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mynameisonlyforthegods a écrit :

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Emphasy a écrit :

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Aim_Deep a écrit :

lol a lot of us asked for hard and GGG went whole hog. Good thing we dont have to worry about it though since high maps dont drop anyway

The issue here is... some mods simply aren't hard, they just make the map impossible.

If you get Bloodmagic on a CI char you simply cannot do the map, it isn't getting any harder.

I don't see that being an issue of any sort. Not all builds are supposed to be able to clear all content in the game.

If you see a wall or obstacle are you supposed to:
a) climb over it?
b) smash it down?
c) go around it?
d) run away and pray you don't come across it again?

Guess which decision immunity mods force you to make... nicegame™
Nice meaningful decision making yeahhhhh.

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Ashen_Shugar_IV a écrit :

If you see a wall or obstacle are you supposed to:
a) climb over it?
b) smash it down?
c) go around it?
d) run away and pray you don't come across it again?

Guess which decision immunity mods force you to make... nicegame™
Nice meaningful decision making yeahhhhh.

Nope. You made that decision when you chose your build.

Your response only further reinforces my point, nice one.

Build Diversity \o/

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Ashen_Shugar_IV a écrit :

Your response only further reinforces my point, nice one.

Build Diversity \o/

Not every build is supposed to clear all content in game. I believe I said this already. The scenario you're looking at would mean every build being same shit, all their weaknesses and strengths the same.

An extremely boring scenario.

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mynameisonlyforthegods a écrit :

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Ashen_Shugar_IV a écrit :

If you see a wall or obstacle are you supposed to:
a) climb over it?
b) smash it down?
c) go around it?
d) run away and pray you don't come across it again?

Guess which decision immunity mods force you to make... nicegame™
Nice meaningful decision making yeahhhhh.

Nope. You made that decision when you chose your build.

Then how about you make a build that can do all modcombinations... It is very likely a life based character with some form of indirect damage. Totem, Traps... minions aren't good enough to survive endgame maps.

It would be maybe tolerable if those mods punish strong builds, but actually the best builds are those utilizing indirect damage via Totems, Traps etc.

So when I decide to use Bloodmagic... a decision that inherently already has so many drawbacks the game desides I cannot do maps with CI and likely some others are punishing as well.

But that is actually not the thing that is the issue with those mods. The issue is they are not hard. This means these Immunities or things like CI do two possible things:

a) They make it impossible for a build to do a map
b) They do nothing at all and give free rarity/quantity/packsize (not sure what they all grant)

There are some very few moments when they actually are difficult, like a Life based char locked out of Auras by Bloodmagic etc. But in general these mods either don't do much at all or make a map impossible.

Some mods should be changed like Curse Immunity and stuff like CI just should not exist. Mods should be something you can respond to or actually provide difficulty (by buffing enemies). But just locking certain mechanics is a terrible design. It is the same issue with Atziri. Freeze/Stun Immunity is kinda reasonable... but Ignite? It would make sense if other DoT mechanics that allow hit and run would be disabled as well, but its just ignite.

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Emphasy a écrit :

Some mods should be changed like Curse Immunity and stuff like CI just should not exist. Mods should be something you can respond to or actually provide difficulty (by buffing enemies). But just locking certain mechanics is a terrible design. It is the same issue with Atziri. Freeze/Stun Immunity is kinda reasonable... but Ignite? It would make sense if other DoT mechanics that allow hit and run would be disabled as well, but its just ignite.

Atziri will most likely be made poison immune in Ascendancy.

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Emphasy a écrit :

Then how about you make a build that can do all modcombinations... It is very likely a life based character with some form of indirect damage. Totem, Traps... minions aren't good enough to survive endgame maps.

It would be maybe tolerable if those mods punish strong builds, but actually the best builds are those utilizing indirect damage via Totems, Traps etc.

So when I decide to use Bloodmagic... a decision that inherently already has so many drawbacks the game desides I cannot do maps with CI and likely some others are punishing as well.

But that is actually not the thing that is the issue with those mods. The issue is they are not hard. This means these Immunities or things like CI do two possible things:

a) They make it impossible for a build to do a map
b) They do nothing at all and give free rarity/quantity/packsize (not sure what they all grant)

There are some very few moments when they actually are difficult, like a Life based char locked out of Auras by Bloodmagic etc. But in general these mods either don't do much at all or make a map impossible.

So... Because CI can't run BM maps, you think it's better for CI to not exist at all?

I feel like I'm missing a point that is possibly present in your post. Map mods are optional, you don't "have to" run mods like BM if your build is not suited to it. For the third and last time, not every build is supposed to clear all content in the game. IF you get a mod that you can't run, just reroll the map.

I don't understand what the problem is. I really don't. Yes, some mods are impossible to run with certain builds and that's not how you think the situation should be. Is that what you're trying to tell me? If so, I simply disagree with the sentiment.

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mynameisonlyforthegods a écrit :

So... Because CI can't run BM maps, you think it's better for CI to not exist at all?

I feel like I'm missing a point that is possibly present in your post. Map mods are optional, you don't "have to" run mods like BM if your build is not suited to it. For the third and last time, not every build is supposed to clear all content in the game. IF you get a mod that you can't run, just reroll the map.

I don't understand what the problem is. I really don't. Yes, some mods are impossible to run with certain builds and that's not how you think the situation should be. Is that what you're trying to tell me? If so, I simply disagree with the sentiment.

The point is, it's contradictory.

Look, in 1.1.4 GGG REMOVED a map mod, chaos damage over time. Here's the patch note and the reason for removing it.

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Chris a écrit :

Map Mods:
We have made changes to how degeneration in map mods is handled. This change was made as the Suffering mod inhibited hybrid life/ES builds from being played. This is a style of defence we would like to see used as an option, however this one map mod was very punitive to this style of play. This map mod also overstressed the requirement for a base amount of life regeneration, which is not equally available to all classes.

- We removed the Suffering map mod and replaced it with two other mods filling the same role, "of Venom" and "of Desecration". The replacement mods keep the chaos damage over time flavour, but are not an always-on effect.

- "of Venom" has been added as a map mod, which gives all the monsters on the map Poison on Hit.

- "of Desecration" has been added as a map mod, which gives the map patches of Desecrated ground.

This made no sense whatsoever while keeping Blood Magic as a map mod.

To then go and add cannot leech is just ridiculous and further contradictory.