PoE 2 has lost over 80% of its players in 3 months.

"

Warrax#2850 a écrit :

Complainers talks like this game was released long ago, GGG didn't even released their first big patch yet (0.2), they are CURRENTLY learning from their mistakes.

Nerfs, buffs and new content is coming, just be patient, they took some dev time to make a quick league for PoE1 as they are trying to please both communities, PoE2's turn is next, please be patient.

As for the retention you can blame the marketing for that, it brought a lot of tourists that probably won't come back, PoE2 by itself is doing pretty well.

You know this is a sequel right? And the game is based a lot on the previous game. It's not a totally brand new game on a brand new genre. They had a lot to learn on their first game and they could have brought this lesson back when they start making this game. But the way they handled thing feel like it's their first game. Of course it's infuriating.

Its great news :D No listening players = no players :D

"

MyTeamFeedsAgain#9940 a écrit :

Pretty sure a big reason for us on hongkong server is that we do not have microtransactions, at least not on PS5. So we can't trade, and stash is limited. It's simply unplayable and ggg instead is focusing on irrelevant bug fixes.

That has probably to do with the separate client China will receive.
For PoE1, China has a different game client with things the Western version does not have, but GGG is only developing the Western version of PoE2 atm.
I would be surprised if you don't get the "China Client" on full release, after they made the changes to the game for that market.

I think this is due to some of the expectations of the endgame content.
Arbiter of Ash I think is the largest culprit. Trying to get so specific parts of the platform in a very short amount of time, but also just not having the part needed to get to be on your screen and be visible, is an unfair expectation.
People farming 20+ hours for the fragments only to die to these guarantee 1 shot mechanics (unless you play the meta builds with godly items and 1 shot him before he does it) usually results in them feeling like it was just a waste of time.

I have over 10 attempts on arbiter of ash on a spark scorc, and 15+ attempts on a invoker monk, both on SSF. I'm not a god gamer but I feel I have an average reaction speed and have still never beaten Arbiter on difficulty 3 or 4.
My farthest attempt was about 20% hp and 2 full mechanic cycles, finally dying to an offscreen meteor.
Many other attempts I died to was the small opening on the fire waves with over 6 meters of travel needed in under 1.5 sec. Sometimes a blink wasn't far enough, or it was too far and I died with my tie still being the the fire.

Xesht I think is one of the best end game bosses. You have time to asses what is happening, and there is a reasonable counter.

"

xheapshot#2641 a écrit :

I think this is due to some of the expectations of the endgame content.
Arbiter of Ash I think is the largest culprit. Trying to get so specific parts of the platform in a very short amount of time, but also just not having the part needed to get to be on your screen and be visible, is an unfair expectation.
People farming 20+ hours for the fragments only to die to these guarantee 1 shot mechanics (unless you play the meta builds with godly items and 1 shot him before he does it) usually results in them feeling like it was just a waste of time.

I have over 10 attempts on arbiter of ash on a spark scorc, and 15+ attempts on a invoker monk, both on SSF. I'm not a god gamer but I feel I have an average reaction speed and have still never beaten Arbiter on difficulty 3 or 4.
My farthest attempt was about 20% hp and 2 full mechanic cycles, finally dying to an offscreen meteor.
Many other attempts I died to was the small opening on the fire waves with over 6 meters of travel needed in under 1.5 sec. Sometimes a blink wasn't far enough, or it was too far and I died with my tie still being the the fire.

Xesht I think is one of the best end game bosses. You have time to asses what is happening, and there is a reasonable counter.

Most people quit before endgame, then before they get to the pinnacle boss. Some, like me, quit after they kill it once. I see no point in focusing on balancing the pinnacle boss while everything else before that needs work.

It’s 2025, and somehow, Grinding Gear Games still thinks XP loss on death is a good idea. Losing hours of progress because of a single mistake or an unavoidable one-shot isn’t a challenge—it’s just frustrating. Instead of creating engaging endgame mechanics, GGG relies on outdated punishment systems that actively push players away.

Other ARPGs are leaning into player-friendly systems that respect time investment, yet GGG remains stubborn. Do they even have a business strategy? Retaining players should be a priority, not punishing them for playing. At this rate, how do they expect to keep a loyal player base when the core experience feels more like a chore than a reward?

It’s time for GGG to evolve—or watch players move on.

"

dubarooski#4619 a écrit :

It’s 2025, and somehow, Grinding Gear Games still thinks XP loss on death is a good idea. Losing hours of progress because of a single mistake or an unavoidable one-shot isn’t a challenge—it’s just frustrating. Instead of creating engaging endgame mechanics, GGG relies on outdated punishment systems that actively push players away.

Other ARPGs are leaning into player-friendly systems that respect time investment, yet GGG remains stubborn. Do they even have a business strategy? Retaining players should be a priority, not punishing them for playing. At this rate, how do they expect to keep a loyal player base when the core experience feels more like a chore than a reward?

It’s time for GGG to evolve—or watch players move on.

Keep in mind, that you normally don't lose "hours of progression" when you die.
Atm we just don't have good ways to gain experience. The area/monster levels are not high enough, no good mechanics to juice for exp, and the game is way more rippy (unbalanced) than it should be yadda yadda.
If you compare that to PoE1 you can see, that you mostly lose a bit of time, but not hours. And no, I don't talk about the fastest dudes out there - nobody expects that normal human beings can level from 1 to 100 under 30 minutes too.

What systems do you mean from other games that "respect time"? Because I hear that a lot, well, not which systems but the phrase "respect my time", so I am curious.

I mean, the "EXP loss on death" might be an old system and some don't like it, but that did not stop ppl from playing "Diablo 2" for 25 years and "PoE1" for nearly 15 years. Sounds to me like these games have a loyal player base.

An ironic position on "EXP loss on death" is the other way they can do this system is make it where only T16 gives exp by how the EXP caps work per level up.


There's many ways they can address Exp loss. They haven't, because that takes effort intention which they don't want to use it for something like this since the rest of the game needs effort.


Here's some examples of alternate ways to do it;

1. Current game
You die, you lose 10% exp. All Content gets you exp reasonably for the level.

2a. Balance the current game around t15/16 content and buff up those mobs exp and increase the amount of exp needed per level by however much they boost these monsters exp award by such a massive amount it's impossible to level up otherwise. Removing the need for exp lost on death "due to insert inflammatory reason why you aren't leveling up."

2b. Balance the current game around t15/16 content and buff up those mobs exp and increase the amount of exp needed per level by however much they boost these monsters exp award by such a massive amount it's impossible to level up otherwise. Keeping Exp lost on death, but the level T15/16 content is much better that it negates this

2c. Balance the current game around t15/16 content and buff up those mobs exp and increase the amount of exp needed per level by however much they boost these monsters exp award by such a massive amount it's impossible to level up otherwise. Keeping Exp lost on death, but the level T15/16 content without aligning the buffs with buffing t15/16 content.

3a. Remove exp gained% from the entire pool of tablets and maps and buff all higher end content by that amount universally. T15 T16 get 40% implicit exp gain and along with the affix being removed entirely from the game. Keep Exp Lost

3b. Remove exp gained% from the entire pool of tablets and maps and buff all higher end content by that amount universally. T15 T16 get 40% implicit exp gain and along with the affix being removed entirely from the game. Reference 2b or 2c variations to add to this.


Highlighted some of the important points. They can address it. Preferably the punishment be removed and the leveling up be higher capped towards higher content only due to them balancing exp from those mobs.

Punishment feels like awful in any instance where you lost sustainably more than you put in. Eg. You die, you lost 5 hours of progress. Sick.

What's even worst is this is pervasive in all the modes of the game and not only maps, meaning if you die anywhere you lose that % exp. Tying you into pretty much only grinding maps if you have any exp or have fun losing all of that built up exp doing Trials.

It's the largest reason I haven't bothered to log in as I have to due maps since I'm at 80% exp to next level and I really don't want to do another map ever, yet if I do any other content I'm triple punished for it.


The designation of this system is short sighted and doesn't have consideration for what they're trying to do.

--

You can bring up other games such as Diablo 2 have these systems, yet the difference is D2R has content balanced up to monster lvl 96 vs only 84 like in PoE2. If we had reasonable content to match our level I don't think many would care that much about exp lost on death since it'd become fairly irrelevant at that point.

They need to move faster on these systems since this leaves such a sour taste in the mouths of players that came here for the "revolution of arpg" which is a lie and they've done very little to follow through.

--

They don't want feedback. They want their vision.

GGG expect (or was the case in PoE) the average player to reach level 90, the dedicated player to reach approx 95 and for level 100 (which I did once and swore I’d never ever do again) to be excessively time consuming.
We could assume the same for PoE2, but the problem currently is no decent xp gain paths. T16 is a crap-shoot with vaaling and imo far too low a return not to mention should imo be a natural drop like in Poe. Additionally there’s lots of endgame content (from PoE that’s good for xp grinds and they have said they want to add more of these old leagues when they’re ready) missing from current endgame. Lastly the lack of even basic crafting bench (life,mana and defence prefixes and resistance and Str/dex/int suffixes) makes getting post 90 level gear extremely unlikely with current ‘gambling’ systems or beyond unreasonably expensive with omens.
The endgame is extremely lacking currently with basically only a handful of endgame fights vs the multitude there are in PoE, the lack of endgame fights I’d expect over time, the lacklustre endgame (lack of older leagues and basic craft I spoke of) far more quickly as the tedium of just mapping (as opposed to mapping, delving,heisting etc) is the biggest turn off after campaign imo

Nothing new to play with. Spend 2 hour watching neighbor's cat walking the fence, more fun than running maps. Missing more than half of the classes and unfinished clunky skills didn't help. 80% of the people don't treat this like testing also didn't help. I blame bad management.