can we please stop the power creep, already? (or better - reverse it)

re: your edited in spoiler:

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Power creep is a natural result of new options ending up more powerful than previous ones. If they werent more powerful in some way, there would be no point inventing the new options. Then they also add new things like infinite 2.0, Uber Atziri < 3.0(?), Shaper < 3.1? 3.2?, Uber Elder < 3.4, Infinite delve where people can use these newfound opportunities. They substantially increase map bosses HP when old content cant keep up. They rebalance old unfair encounters (Atziri immune to most mechanics), while often also buffing them numerically to become relevant again. They add new drops to underplayed encounters (Pale Court upgraded loot table with with original loot table reallocated to their prophecy chains). Etc etc etc

1. yet another fallacy. new tiers/etc were hardly necessary to add. we hardly needed more power.

2. there is no balance, anyway. the mobs/game got way easier overall, thereby sinking your own claim. the absurd amount of power creep compounded this into the nuke entire screens meta we've had since ascendancy.

3. it's hardly necessary to add more power in order to add more content.

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DeathKnight_Berserker a écrit :

I`m done, i say what i think and my points stand. Whether you like it or not.

umm... no.

there is no vast conspiracy.

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Zorajin a écrit :

Power creep is a natural result of new options ending up more powerful than previous ones. If they werent more powerful in some way, there would be no point inventing the new options.

This is not completely true.

If a new "option" is 10 times stronger than everything else, it's not really an option anymore as it's by far the best choice.

Good options could be new mechanics, interesting systems/interactions, or such .... without somewhat invalidating the previous options.
This is much more difficult to achieve than just giving power to player of course, but it's also healthier for the game if done well, imho.

Again not true.

With this items, as you see most gems are 20/20 or 21/20, and my passive i would say are great for this build i still dying.
Died 2 time in t16 Hydra, one shooted me, while i`m at 6,6k life right now.
I was Double Striking at it and could not move in time, he one shooted me. Then freezed and died again.
In Delve 220+, mobs drop my hp bar quite often, died 3 times delving.
And that is with a character that i would say is invested heavy into.
This items is not easy to get. Unless you have 300+ exalted in the stash.
This build without flask and buff have 16k armour, 6,6k life, 70% block to attack and spell, i said it again in town without a buff.
With all buff, DS DPS goes to 150k, and still it`s took quite some time to kill the guardians. If the map has nasty mods you will die.

But you feel the game hard if not rmt, if you not played for 4-5 years and as well, not skipping all boses, like you probably do.
Most people goes on Burial or easy maps, skip the boses, and that`s how they maining currency.
Then the game is superb easy ....
And before tell me i`m bad in the game i`m programmer and also played warcraft 3 for long time, and i can say my micro control is on very decent level.
Once again, unless you use some build, that are op at the moment(i have no problem with that), or spend 100-200+ exalted, this game offer plenty of challenge, and by no means is easy.

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DeathKnight_Berserker a écrit :

Again not true.

With this items, as you see most gems are 20/20 or 21/20, and my passive i would say are great for this build i still dying.
Died 2 time in t16 Hydra, one shooted me, while i`m at 6,6k life right now.
I was Double Strike at it and could not move in time, he one shooted me. Then freezed and died again.
In Delve 220+, mobs drop my hp bar quite often, died 3 times delving.
And that is with a character that i would say is invested heavy into.
This items is not easy to get. Unless you have 300+ exalted in the stash.
This build without flask and buff have 16k defence, 6,6k life, 70% block to attack and spell i said it again in town without a buff.
With all buff, DS DPS goes to 150k, and still it`s took quite some time to kill the guardians. If the map has nasty mods you will die.

But you feel the game hard if not rmt, if you not played for 4-5 years and as well, not skipping all boses, like you probably do.
Most people goes on Burial or easy maps, skip the boses, and that`s how they maining currency.
Then the game is superb easy ....
And before tell me i`m bad in the game i`m programmer and also played warcraft 3 for long time, and i can say my micro control is on very decent level.
Once again, unless you use some build, that are op at the moment(i have no problem with that), or spend 100-200+ exalted, this game offer plenty of challenge, and by no means is easy.

...

are you accusing me of RMT because you play poorly and die?

also, you're playing a gladiator with surrender... why bother with vaal pact?

and ffs, you're not even using the anvil. are you using conversion trap? if not, why are you using that helm enchant (and zero implicits on gloves/boots, too)? and you seem to only have max res at 75.

did you at least reduce your max frenzy charges to 0?


protip:



edit: oh, right. you're the guy using ancestral call and melee splash. *facepalm*

you ironically just proved MY point. you joined only a few months ago and clearly haven't learned much at all about the mechanics/how to build a char... and you still managed to make level 96. the game is far too easy.

Protip. I dont still use enchants. That`s not something that is done in few hours to get the right ones.
Wanna first get to 98, then will start chasing enchants.
Atziri Gloves are used for crit chance, good life, high armour, as well for the better part of Vaal Pact + the needed int, that melee lacks.
As i said before i have this, that are quite one, but dmg different is not much, yet Vaal Pact feel great. Instant life ones are a lot better, but they are quite pricey.



Otherwise i have to spend passive points in int or find rings with int, that are nasty pricey with other good rolls and very rare as well.
And are you realizing that with Anvil amulet, my DPS will go down by 50k.
Block chance at 79% are enough.
Anvil amulet is not an eng game item, and never was. Great tip you giving me ....
And i don`t know much people in this game that not dying to some map/mods/boses.
Again we are big on words and that is.
That just shows you the game is far from easy.
On words i can beat Klitschko in boxing ....
Also why you locked your profile, let us see your undying characters.
And i never accusing anyone on rmt. But i`m pretty sure a lot of people do that.
But you are speaking for someone that you don`t even know, but yet are saying he is playing poorly ....
What you want to change in the game, won`t happen and won`t happen for good.
The game is not still in beta for such big jumps from one side to another.
As well that will limit build diversity, and this is what makes the game so interesting.

As far as go for my character. I said it long time ago i don`t aim only for damage. I aim for complete balance. Solid character on attack, same on defence. Yeah i don`t use some of the meta builds/items, thats totally goes on offense, but this is the diversity i was talking about.
As i said 5 time ago, i equp second sword or Rigward and my DPS is 3x time higher. But i play what i like, as everyone should.
There is nothing wrong in my build.
And i started using Ancestral Call kinda recently, and i never regret it. First was thinking why Path of Exile Builds(guy/s that have site for guides and youtube videos guide) are using it on their vaal double strike dual wield champion, then i realize why.
It`s change your clear speed by a lot, but before you try it, you won`t understand.
There is a very good Mara Jug build with Heavy Strike, the guy also use Ancestral Call and Melee Splash ...

And as i said i`m returning player. Played the game back in beta for quite some time. But i decide to stop back there, and this year return to the game. It`s totally different game though.

And btw don`t think i`m biased to the game needs to offer new, new, new things and mods.
I also don`t like some of the new mods. This 30% quality on weap/armour to be fair i don`t like it.
It`s going to destroy prices on some items. Also some of the new armour/weapon mods.
But i`m not complaining. The game is constantly changing. We don`t know what exactly DEVS plans are, and what new content are comping. How tougher some of the new things will be, and as i said time after time - delving. Goes deeper, getting harder.

Before few weeks i think, there was a guy that was making a thread like this, but it was that the game is too hard, especially for casual and the game need to be overall easier, especially end game boses.
I was totally against it. Just like now.
There have to be balance between.

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robmafia a écrit :

you ironically just proved MY point. you joined only a few months ago and clearly haven't learned much at all about the mechanics/how to build a char... and you still managed to make level 96. the game is far too easy.

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DeathKnight_Berserker a écrit :

- Why are you even arguing anymore, you stated and repeated the same points already at least 10 times.

Are you a dev if not why are you fighting like your life depend of this thread. Just go on with your life and like you said let the devs decide.

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DeathKnight_Berserker a écrit :

...

Well, I agree with one point that was buried in your post, which is that certain OP builds trivialize guardians, shaper, elder, etc. That’s why build balance has to be addressed in order to address power creep - as I said before (although I was being a bit rambly) the two problems are related and can’t be fixed independently.

Other than that, you seem to be arguing that power creep isn’t an issue because your specific build dies in T16 maps and in 200+ delves. Well, so do many of my builds bc I don’t like being locked into meta choices, but that’s all beside the point: that tiny slice of the game isn’t what we should be focusing on.

The issue isn’t whether T16 maps and deep delves are hard, the issue is that mapping all the other tiers is mind-numbingly easy even with incredibly basic character investment.

We should indeed be able to earn the ability to screen-clear (bc that’s fun), and for some players who can earn that instantly no matter what the game will always be too easy (Kiss’s stories about killing shaper in 24 hours or easily beating all content with Sweep show he’s an extreme outlier). But right now we’re just handed screen-clearing with little thought required, and that’s boring.

At my level of gameplay, T15+ maps and 200+ delving still feels like an accomplishment, but everything else beforehand doesn’t. And there are many players at a much higher level than I (often, but not always, playing better builds than I choose to play) for whom my challenges are yawn-inducing too. They need stuff to aspire to as well, and it’s not so simple as buffing a bunch of bosses/mobs.

Without those goals, there’s little incentive to work towards anything in this game. I think league challenges are meant to help fill that void, but it’s not enough (nor are those fun for everyone; I personally never cared much for them).

Final thought: agree with some others who have pointed out that it is possible to release new exciting content without power creep. The different league mechanics are already a good example of this, along with new styles of gameplay like hybrid attacker/summoner, but new skills/gear that are multiple times as powerful as old ones are not.

Frankly, I still think adding shaper/elder items as they currently stand was a mistake!

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robmafia a écrit :

"

robmafia a écrit :

you ironically just proved MY point. you joined only a few months ago and clearly haven't learned much at all about the mechanics/how to build a char... and you still managed to make level 96. the game is far too easy.

My average day time is probably 6-8 hours on average, because right now i have very free time. It won`t be like that forever.
In a MMORPG on any other game, for the time i`m in this game i would have beat all the content and get to max level for sure.
But i play what i like, not focusing on same map for currency or same map for leveling.
I`m taking my time and try to do what it`s fun for me.
demon9675, i don`t complain because of my build. I have no problem with deaths, they are part of the game.

But there is plenty of player and builds, that are not so op, and not everyone can get to point, where he can clear t14+ as easy and as fast as others.
You have to understand that main focus right now is leagues. And if they make it harder, a lot harder, or nerf this, this, and that, a lot of player that play only leagues will quit, because many people will be ruined, and players will get mad.
It`s obvious. That`s why they make unique after unique,to unlock new things so people to try and use new builds.

Anyway that was last from me.
Hf all.