PoE is stacked against the solo player

Wow Worldbreaker, never thought I'd live to see the day that you're advocating against making the game harder ("enemies deal extra damage to parties").

I thought you were hardcore...?

Worldbreakers arguments only hold up under the idea that you are meant to party and soloing is seen as a challenge run.
GGG claims that soloing is meant to be similarly viable.

Currently solo is viable, but the difference between solo and group is huge if you have even the smallest bit of coordination. It's not similarly viable, despite being viable.

I don't like the title to this thread.

First off, every video you can find of players handling super-difficult content — Atziri, very difficult map bosses, etc. — is almost always solo. They might party off and on, perhaps on the way there, but it definitely seems that partying does not convert an unsafe adventure into a safe one, since that will probably kill you solo still probably kill you in a party.

What I think partying does do is make rather undangerous, or only marginally dangerous, monsters easier. The only real chance white (and to some extent blue) monsters have against players is the ability to overwhelm them with numbers, a horde versus a much smaller but much more powerful group. Partying almost completely mitigates the threat in such a case. However, white monsters aren't that much of a challenge to anyone under normal circumstances, and blues only rarely.

The primary factor for partying at higher levels of play seems to be splitting map costs and exploiting the way XP is divvied up. These two systems could definitely use a review to make mapping costs more even between party and solo, and most importantly, to stop showing groups with far more XP than they deserve.

After an overhaul of those two broken systems, I imagine it might be nice if party bonuses included a pack density modifier (which is also a kind of loot and XP bonus) such that a group of six players actually could be overwhelmed by the sheer numbers of normal monsters, at least in the kind of situations where are solo player with similar strategies would find themselves overwhelmed. But that would definitely have to come after an XP rework, because partying doesn't need another XP bonus right now.

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pneuma a écrit :

Wow Worldbreaker, never thought I'd live to see the day that you're advocating against making the game harder ("enemies deal extra damage to parties").

I thought you were hardcore...?

Really pneuma?

I was referring to solo play being buffed, idgaf what happens in parties, I play solo 99% of the time.

I think the trolls have rubbed off on you and scrotie, underhand jabs and such.

Think I've logged in once since the unique buff.

Path of Casuals

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dspair a écrit :

Maybe they don't care because rolling maps solo is the biggest bullshit in this game? I know that's why I don't care.

No, as said before rolling maps is very cheap now with all the map drop buffs implemented in the past.

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dspair a écrit :

Let me guess, you do maps in a 6 man party all day erry day and don't want parties to be balanced, that's why you shitpost in this thread with silly arguments, ignoring any sense?

No, I play solo most of the time because it is better most of the time. I don't have a dedicated group, and playing in random groups is usually a pain in the ass and I'm much better off soloing.

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dspair a écrit :

Many people already said why you are wrong, I stopped reading your posts after the 3rd page, but you are still at it.

They really didn't. They would've been right a year ago, where maintaining a map pool solo was quite literally impossible, but now? Nope.

Mapping is way easier than it has ever been. Last character i started after taking few months break here. Hes now deleted out of boredom of that character and rolling a new one now.

Started mapping with single tropical island and this is the result in under month of mapping



AND few stash tabs full of 70-72 maps and one tab for under 70maps.

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Xavderion a écrit :

1. Usually around 20/100 (and thus better than any group without a dedicated culler, do the math.)
2. Decent.
3. Decent.
4. Increasing.

What now? x)

If you play in a group without a culler, you're gimping yourself with your own choice.

Decent? Share your build with gear.
By the way, when was the last time you've played Ambush? Your experience is outdated, sorry.

Anyway, what now? Nothing, your MF is still very low compared to a group one, which exactly proves my point.
Even if your MF was 300+, you'd be doing better solo (assuming that your clear speed and survivability are decent and your currency increasing), you would catch a point where you won't be able to progress solo (maybe not you, obviously).

I don't even know why am I responding to your in this thread anymore after you've conveniently ignored that part of my post, which makes it all clear.

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Dawmz a écrit :

My IIQ/IIR is 0/100 for rares and bosses, Im culling obviously.
Survivability and clear speed are insanely good but that has a lot more to do with the build than anything else
My currency is largely increasing. I was totally broke on invasion before the 2 week race started (played the first week invasion then had to stop poe for a while), since then I levelled 3 chars to 70 and up, bought some uniques (searing touch, carcass jack), a lot of rares and have something like 15ex in my stash.

Same thing.

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Xavnderion a écrit :

No, as said before rolling maps is very cheap now with all the map drop buffs implemented in the past.

Maybe you should start alching maps, when you start playing again. Of course it's cheap trans/alt/aug 71/72 maps ;)
Again, Standard exists.

You're just ridiculous.

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tinko92 a écrit :

If you play in a group without a culler, you're gimping yourself with your own choice.

Most groups don't come with a dedicated culler -> I'm better off soloing :)

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tinko92 a écrit :

Decent? Share your build with gear.

Ah, the old 'I don't believe you' argument. I guess you never had a good solo build? Should I educate you on making one? x) I clear maps in 10 minutes max and only lightning thorns can really kill me. And some bosses which every random group would skip anyway :D Decent enough considering my gear is worth 5-6 ex in total.

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tinko92 a écrit :

By the way, when was the last time you've played Ambush? Your experience is outdated, sorry.

Not sure, about a week ago? Nothing changed since then. Are you butthurt beacuse I called you out on having outdated standard league experiences? :3

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tinko92 a écrit :

Anyway, what now? Nothing, your MF is still very low compared to a group one, which exactly proves my point.

Nope, compared to any group without a culler (which are most random groups), my MF is much, much better. Again, do the math.

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tinko92 a écrit :

Even if your MF was 300+, you'd be doing better solo (assuming that your clear speed and survivability are decent and your currency increasing), you would catch a point where you won't be able to progress solo (maybe not you, obviously).

See above, my MF is a fine combination of MF and kill speed and provides considerably more loot than in any group without a culler.

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tinko92 a écrit :

I don't even know why am I responding to your in this thread anymore after you've conveniently ignored that part of my post, which makes it all clear.

I responded to your point a couple of times now, it has no weight in this discussion. Five pages ago, I said an optimally composed group will do better than a solo player (as it should). Doesn't change the fact that overall and on average soloing and grouping are fairly equally viable.

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tinko92 a écrit :

Maybe you should start alching maps, when you start playing again. Of course it's cheap trans/alt/aug 71/72 maps ;)

I was alching maps since level 70. Alchs aren't exactly expensive ;)

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tinko92 a écrit :

Again, Standard exists.

Again, I'm only talking about Ambush, the most current version of the game.

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tinko92 a écrit :

You're just ridiculous.

And you're mad :3

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Xavderion a écrit :

Most groups don't come with a dedicated culler -> I'm better off soloing :)

Hilarious response.
Obviously you're better off soloing if you cannot find a group with a MF culler.

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Ah, the old 'I don't believe you' argument. I guess you never had a good solo build? Should I educate you on making one? x) I clear maps in 10 minutes max and only lightning thorns can really kill me. And some bosses which every random group would skip anyway :D Decent enough considering my gear is worth 5-6 ex in total.

So where is the problem in sharing the build and gear? It's very simple and you're complicating it for nothing, or for something :)
Yes, I've never heard of a good solo build, educate me and show me yours, I don't care about your wordy descriptions/stories.

Easy, where is the problem?

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Not sure, about a week ago? Nothing changed since then. Are you butthurt beacuse I called you out on having outdated standard league experiences? :3

You've played it for an hour, and you have that character since the beginning of Ambush, 2+ months of not playing the game and in that time got 6 more levels than my character.

You're embarrassing yourself with the outdated argument, really.

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Nope, compared to any group without a culler (which are most random groups), my MF is much, much better. Again, do the math.

The math is that you're incompetent in finding a group with higher MF, and that's why you're obviously better off solo.

We should add that up in the pro-solo stuff.

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I responded to your point a couple of times now, it has no weight in this discussion. Five pages ago, I said an optimally composed group will do better than a solo player (as it should). Doesn't change the fact that overall and on average soloing and grouping are fairly equally viable.

No you haven't. I'll copy-paste it.
- "Like I've said, the only case where solo play is better than group play is when you have a character that has very high MF, high survivability and high clear speed, and that can only be achieved with ranged characters.
And that's before leveling starts being super expensive, when it gets, even that character is better off in group play."

And that doesn't hold weight? What does?

Why should a group "do better" than solo at any occasion?
Isn't grouping supposed to be for the multiplayer experience?
"Nobody would group if grouping wasn't more efficient" is as bad as it can be, people who like to play with others would group up, that's their incentive, their fun factor.

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Again, I'm only talking about Ambush, the most current version of the game.

Epic... and a sign that I should really stop this ridiculousness.

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And you're mad :3

Shocked.

Considering how after every 4 month season they implement components from the challenge leagues into Standard and Hardcore, don't you think just a little tiny bit that your clinging to current conditions in standard is indeed outdated? If not, we should table this discussion for 1 month so you can get a good feel for the direction the game is heading.