Increased Item Quantity and Rarity seem to work backwards

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Hellkaiser a écrit :

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Martinezz123 a écrit :

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Hellkaiser a écrit :

people are probably NOT understanding how MF in general works and why it's rubbish.

100% increase of a 1% drop item, is 2%

400% increase of a 1% drop item is 4%

all that increased RARITY will do is increase the chance that it will drop by a percentile of an unknown number and probably only if the BASE item rolls to drop (unless I'm mistaken, which I might be) so without increased QUANTITY in order to possibly cause more drops, the increased favorable RNG is missing a piece of the puzzle really.

Also, isn't there a minimum itemlevel which determines if a base item can roll a unique or not?

Hellkaiser - exactly.
That's why I've made a topic about "what's the base item rarity".
Couldn't get any answer.
The topic is here:
http://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/341387/page/1#p2996887
Base item Quantity is know however.
As far as I remember is about 16% from a normal mob.


But. Actually it does not matter what the base item rarity is.
It may be even 1% without the stats.
But the system of increasing it should be made the way that you actually feel the increase.
If the increase from 1% to 2% is unnoticeable, the actual % of increasing it, you have, should work some other way. For example it should be multiplied by some amount for the players to feel the difference.
We don't need to know the intrinsic mechanics.
What we should know, is that it actually works.

Actually, this is why I HATE the drop system in this game, it's INCREDIBLY sloppy, and simply based on itemlevel I have seen it being used in games made my rpg maker... and usually only because it saves time, not because it is a superior system. And NO "simple" is not synonymous with "The best possible choice" EVER. PERIOD. GTFO.

I also HATE a lack of transparency with drop rates etc in games, the whole "Ohohoho but it's a surprise when it drops" or "Ohohoh can you find that item and what boss it drops from" etc just makes me feel slightly patronized, I'm not a 3 year old that needs that kind of amusement... and all it really does it change what would be a set goal into a random length of time somewhere between immediately and when the sun burns out.

Yes this game is supposed to be along the lines of Diablo 2 because Diablo 3 is following in the WORST aspects of greed thanks to the much larger effect of back seat driver publishers pushing for "idiot proof" material, but going THIS far backwards is also NOT the way to do things. Here's a shocker for ya, Diablo 2 was NOT a perfect game, FAR FAR FAR FAR FAR... FAR from it. It had a myriad of flaws that were then altered by modders to create BETTER results and for the most part they SUCCEEDED. However, despite this game directly taking quite a lot of the good from them, they ALSO seem to have tweaked the game BACKWARDS towards the original by making it LESS rewarding...

Hint: IF most modders created popular sub games, which in many cases outshone the original game in many eyes by INCREASING the effort to reward ratio, it's generally NOT a great idea to then UNDO that change.

IF that's the case, why not keep HC mode as the punishing type with low rewards to keep all those guys super entertained with their hardcore game, and work on better ways for the unwashed masses to gear up in default?? (yes i'm aware default is an item dump for HC, I don't like it)

We can't even add x stat to any existing mods via orbs, that was like.... one of the BASIC changes that improved Diablo 2 in all it's mods... what happened? did you develop good idea blindness? XD (sorry GGG lads and lassies, but have to be harsh)

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Hellkaiser a écrit :

It's not even all of it, I don't mind some of the older aspects, and they do fall into the "if it ain't broke" category for me. But this game is currently and more importantly later on in it's progression extremely and almost completely... overtuned

And the harder your game is, the less RNG you should have, and that's my strong belief on that matter.

Skill beats difficulty, your input and the quality of your decisions and actions help you overcome the harder content, however nothing but luck beats randomness. And artificial difficulty born of randomness is NEVER something that should be aimed for or in the very least should be controlled as much as possible.

If I was to summarize the largest flaw in this game, or at least 4 of the deal breakers that hold this game back from greatness.

1: A massive reliance on RNG, to the point that you find it to be the deadliest enemy to your enjoyment of the game.

2: Overtuned content

3: A lack of a passive tree that offers REAL freedom and is FREE of "noob trap" passives, why don't we start in the middle, and branch our way out from the same node with USEFUL and BUILD DEFINING nodes being closer to the center, and PERCENTILE INCREASES being further away, you know, where they SCALE the best and give the most IMMEDIATE returns and most NOTICEABLE increases to stats????

4: Due to issues 1 and 2, the game is a "marketeers" paradise, and those guys ALWAYS suck the life and fun and joy out of everything when they become the prime targets to set the status quo.

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BearCares a écrit :

nope, I get these kind of drops pretty regularly with IIQ/IIR but not without



swimming in shitty uniques and unsellable rares YYYYEEEEEE HAAAAA

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Hellkaiser a écrit :

people are probably NOT understanding how MF in general works and why it's rubbish.

100% increase of a 1% drop item, is 2%

400% increase of a 1% drop item is 4%

all that increased RARITY will do is increase the chance that it will drop by a percentile of an unknown number and probably only if the BASE item rolls to drop

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ScrotieMcB a écrit :

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Hellkaiser a écrit :

people are probably NOT understanding how MF in general works and why it's rubbish.

100% increase of a 1% drop item, is 2%

400% increase of a 1% drop item is 4%

all that increased RARITY will do is increase the chance that it will drop by a percentile of an unknown number and probably only if the BASE item rolls to drop

You're not mistaken, except for the part where you call it rubbish.

100% IIQ of a 1% drop item is still only 2%

0% IIQ with 100% more DPS and 100% more movespeed = kill twice as fast = only 2% in the same amount of time

In terms of survivability and whether you can clear content or not, IIR/IIQ do very little... but when it comes to speedfarming content that you can handle pretty easily, IIQ is very strong, and IIR isn't bad either.

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Martinezz123 a écrit :

I have to say that GGG definitely has done something to the IR and IQ from the time I've posted my first IR and IQ problem (means a few days), because today the case is completely different.
With no change in gear I get quite acceptable loot in case of both IR and IQ.
I don't mean by that, that I get best uniques ever. I mean that they've ripped out the rusty swords, and this kind of crap, and rose it to the more or less level of full plates at 30lvl map.
The difference between killing a white mob and a yellow one is also noticeable now.


I'm sure about the difference between then and now because it's huge.
Nice they've done something.
Not nice no one said anything to us about that.


And I must admit that this only change have risen the satisfaction level from slashing mobs reasonably.
Good work.
I hope there will be some other good changes too.