Why losing experience on death in Path of Exile 2 is Beneficial

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SpankyKong#9805 a écrit :

but if we're talking about trade to help while also saying punishment is necessary for sense of accomplishment & rewards... that's kind of talking out of both sides, isn't it?

There is no contradiction here, because the need for a market, its ability to meet your needs, and the difficulty of making progress are all linked.

The further you move through the content, the harder it is for you to get an item (the number of options increases) and the only way to get something is to buy it on the market, for which you must get currency. The better you grind currency, the easier it is for you to buy items, the better the items, the further you are and the easier it is for you to grind currency.

A game about grinding. Currency grinding.

There is really no casino here, because you can win at the casino...

If the SSF works, then the market will not be needed, the difficulty will drop, because you no longer need to be better, you just wait for something to fall on your head, as it happens up to level 60-70. It's not bad, and it's not good. It's just that. And It's obvious that the developers see the game differently now.

OP should post a screenshot of his or her character so we know this is someone who can walk-the-walk and is not just some forum troll pushing the same buttons they know will rile people up.

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voodoochile78#9787 a écrit :

OP should post a screenshot of his or her character so we know this is someone who can walk-the-walk and is not just some forum troll pushing the same buttons they know will rile people up.

got U homie. that's just 1 char

I don't see the point in making whatever AI rehash things that have already been said into this hugely tl;dr thread with silly ticks, crosses and bullet points. People either like the exp loss or they don't, you should accept that instead of trying to bore them into agreeing with you.

All of that "meaningful encounters" and fears of other people "brute forcing" through the game are nonsense. Leagues last around 3 months and there is no brute forcing through that if your gear isn't good enough. Leveling is a slog with or without exp loss on death. The ONLY benefit to it is that some players will still feel they have a useless goal to chase before realising the endgame isn't actually that good.

If you're not juicing your maps you're not getting good drops. If your gear or skill is so bad you need to brute force through maps then you're not going to complete juiced maps. EXP isn't the endgame, currency is.

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Puente#5374 a écrit :

1️⃣ Encouraging player skill and growth.
One of the core aspects of POE2 is that skill matters. Unlike modern RPGs that prioritize accessibility, POE2 is designed to reward mastery. Experience loss on death serves as a natural incentive for players to improve, reinforcing:

- Better game knowledge – Learning enemy attack patterns and boss mechanics.
- Stronger defensive strategies – Investing in resistances, mitigation, and sustain.
- Improved reaction time and positioning – Avoiding lethal damage rather than just stacking DPS.

Without a meaningful penalty for death, players could brute-force their way through content with no incentive to adapt. Instead, each death becomes a learning opportunity, making every victory feel earned.

I don't relate to this at all. 99.99% of games have 0 death penalty and yet I think nobody is brute forcing anything in these other games. Dying is losing. That's it. If it takes you 3 trys to kill something, you're still going to want to do it in 2 or less next time, with or without death penalty. I don't see why you're even playing a game if you need that kind of threat to be better. When I play monopoly, I want to win even without a gun to my head.

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Puente#5374 a écrit :

2️⃣ Maintaining a Sense of Risk and Reward.
POE2 thrives on a risk-versus-reward system. If there were no penalty for death, the thrill of overcoming difficult content would be significantly reduced.

With no consequences for dying:
x Players could mindlessly rush through encounters.
x Boss fights would feel like a repetitive grind rather than an achievement.
x The game would lose its signature high-stakes tension.

With experience loss, every battle matters:
✔ Boss fights become thrilling and rewarding instead of trivial.
✔ Players must think strategically about engaging in difficult content.
✔ Victory feels meaningful because risk was involved.

The fear of losing experience makes high-stakes battles intense and exhilarating, adding a real sense of achievement when players overcome tough encounters.

So when you just leveled and has no xp to loose, the game becomes bland ? No thrill, no reward, no strategy, no meaning in victory ?
Even with XP Penalty a lot of players don't do any of this because they pay somebody to do it in their place.

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Puente#5374 a écrit :

3️⃣ Preventing Over-Leveling and Preserving Challenge.
Many RPGs allow players to grind endlessly to overcome difficulty. However, POE2 prevents this by making experience loss a soft level cap for players struggling with content.

Without experience loss:
- Players could over-level and bypass difficult encounters.
- Challenge would become meaningless, making progression feel hollow.
- The game would become grind-first, skill-second.

With experience loss:
✔ Players must engage with content at the right difficulty rather than grinding past it.
✔ The game maintains consistent challenge throughout progression.
✔ Reaching high levels feels like an achievement, not just a matter of time spent.

This ensures that POE2 remains a skill-based game rather than a pure numbers grind.

When we say that we don't want XP Penalty, the response we have is : lvl 100 is not for everybody and that every build is functional at lvl90 and those last points are really not necessary.
Now, you say we can over level content. You guys need to get your stories straight.
Well this lvl100 is actually a pure number grind and as nothing to do with skill. You just need to throw hundreds of hours or currencies and that's it. I don't doubt that some people go for level 100 SSF and that's great but the % of playerbase must be pretty low.

Also once again, what I conclude when I see your arguments is that all challenge and appeal in playing the game disappear at level 100 because apparently you have nothing to lose anymore.

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Puente#5374 a écrit :

4️⃣ Reinforcing the Importance of Defensive Investment.
Many new players in POE prioritize offense over defense, leading to frequent deaths. The experience loss mechanic subtly teaches players to balance their builds instead of focusing only on DPS.

How this mechanic improves character building:
✔ Encourages investment in life, energy shield, block, and resistances.
✔ Rewards players for using defensive flasks, movement skills, and mitigation.
✔ Promotes build diversity instead of just a glass-cannon meta.


Instead of punishing players arbitrarily, the system incentivizes smart character building and survival strategies.

I think you understand the important of defensive layers way before the introduction of XP Penalty.
Getting one shot is not fun, even without death penalty. Games without death penalty are not glass cannon metas.
"Rewards player for using defensive flasks, movement skills, and mitigation." Not loosing 10% XP is not a reward.

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Puente#5374 a écrit :

5️⃣ Preserving the Economy and Game Longevity
Experience loss on death indirectly benefits POE2’s economy and longevity by preventing excessive character progression.

Without an experience penalty:
x Players would max out too quickly, leading to faster burnout.
x High-level items and rewards would become devalued due to overpopulation of high-level players.
x Progression would feel less meaningful, as everyone could reach max level effortlessly.

With experience loss:
✔ Leveling remains a long-term goal, giving players a reason to keep playing.
✔ The economy stays balanced, maintaining item value and rarity.
✔ Reaching level 100 remains a prestigious achievement rather than an expectation.

This mechanic ensures that POE2 remains a challenging, rewarding game with a lasting endgame experience.

x Players would max out too quickly, leading to faster burnout.

Players who play 10 hours a day maybe. Players with 2 hours max per day would probably be level 100 after 2 months, long after players with 10h/day have stopped the game.

x High-level items and rewards would become devalued due to overpopulation of high-level players.

That's possible, but maybe not. Without death penalty, players are encouraged to do bosses themselves and therefore buy extra gear instead of putting currency in boss trade. Extra currency in gear means more demand, means more active market and higher prices. But then again i'm just speculating like you.

x Progression would feel less meaningful, as everyone could reach max level effortlessly.

If you need to compare yourself with other to measure your prowess, i understand, it's a very natural behavior when you're on the right side of the line.
But then again if you think reaching level 100 should be a real effort you should fight against boosting and advocate for delevel instead of supporting a state that only punishes casuals and mid tier players.

✔ Leveling remains a long-term goal, giving players a reason to keep playing.
giving SOME players a reason to keep playing, if I say 5% i'm probably very generous.

✔ The economy stays balanced, maintaining item value and rarity.
You can't say how the economy would be otherwise. It's just an assumption not a fact.

✔ Reaching level 100 remains a prestigious achievement rather than an expectation.
Then put XP penalty from level 99 to 100, that way you prestige doesn't get in
the way of my progress.

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Puente#5374 a écrit :

Conclusion: A Necessary Mechanic for well balanced ARPG
While experience loss on death may seem frustrating, it serves a vital role in POE2’s game design philosophy:

✔ Encourages skill development – Players must learn mechanics and improve.
✔ Adds meaningful risk and reward – Victory feels thrilling and deserved.
✔ Prevents trivial over-leveling – Keeps content challenging and engaging.
✔ Teaches the importance of defense – Survivability matters just as much as damage.
✔ Preserves game longevity – Keeps leveling and the economy balanced.

Instead of viewing experience loss as a punishment, players should embrace it as a challenge that makes every victory feel truly earned.

Path of Exile 2 is not meant to be an easy game—it is a test of skill, strategy, and perseverance. Those who rise to the challenge will find a deeper sense of satisfaction and mastery that few other games can offer.


I know that experience loss on death is a hotly debated topic, and opinions on it can vary widely. Some players see it as an essential challenge, while others feel it creates unnecessary frustration. What do you think? Does experience loss make the game more rewarding, or do you feel it needs adjustments? Would you prefer an alternative system, such as temporary debuffs or currency loss instead?

Let’s discuss! Share your thoughts, experiences, and ideas—I’d love to hear different perspectives on how POE2 can strike the perfect balance between challenge and fun!

It's nice to see some well developed post with this point of view. As for myself I 100% disagree with you. I hope I didn't come across as aggressive or dismissive if it's the case that was not intended.

nope. get rid of the exp loss and balance the game.

edit:
you know how to know that this is a troll post? because people that give feedback on the game talk about how they would want the game mechanics changed to make their game experience better. This guy wrote a paper to oppose other people's feedback of "exp loss is problematic." this post isn't game feedback, its opposition to actual feedback that OP read on the forums.

Also, "Why losing experience on death in path of exile 2 is beneficial" conveniently ignores the mass of posts explaining how exp loss is, so very specifically, not beneficial for each OP.

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Vinsdvalh#0247 a écrit :

It's nice to see some well developed post with this point of view. As for myself I 100% disagree with you. I hope I didn't come across as aggressive or dismissive if it's the case that was not intended.

I don’t mind at all! I actually appreciate you sharing your point of view. Disagreeing is completely normal and healthy.

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finalhatdeed#0459 a écrit :

nope. get rid of the exp loss and balance the game.

Also, "Why losing experience on death in path of exile 2 is beneficial" conveniently ignores the mass of posts explaining how exp loss is, so very specifically, not beneficial for each OP.

I appreciate and respect every point of view. There is no 1 truth in this world, everything is a matter of perspective.

Lol, it's not an on-off switch with no options.

Just let the player get back and pick up their body to recover most/all of the XP. Easy, reduces frustration, still creates risk and potential loss.

This problem was solved ages ago. This is not talking to all the balance issues etc that impact the death or how likely it is, just the mechanic of XP loss.

OP asked chat GPT and posted the response. Anyone with actual experience above lvl 85, especially 90, knows it does not encourage player skill and growth, it does the opposite. It forces players into a meta build that involves clicking 1 button to AOE screen clear enemies on the edge of the screen while backing up. I was using 10x the skill in the campaign.

If monster levels could actually scale up to lvl 90+, which would prevent having to spend hours to regain XP, then it might work.