Life vs energy shield question

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TwitchGLHFsport#2155 a écrit :

someone should experiment with a sorc using a shield and mallet with ES. I highly doubt it would be good.

I think they could make some nodes for sorc that can benefits armor/ES items,
Now that's a good Archmage.

What are you even talking about? There are builds with mace/shield Sorceress.

With Druid being released, there's tons of Armor/ES nodes all very close to Sorceress' starting point. The Disciple of Varashta ascendency specifically has a node that applies 60% of your current ES to apply to your Armor for physical damage reduction.

I'm playing a Sorceress right now using Armor/ES and I didn't even go with DoV for my ascendency. She's decently tanky. Armor/ES nodes are everywhere, just like going Evasion/ES on a Huntress or Ranger by traveling towards Monk's area of the tree.

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Rora-hime#7011 a écrit :

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TwitchGLHFsport#2155 a écrit :

someone should experiment with a sorc using a shield and mallet with ES. I highly doubt it would be good.

I think they could make some nodes for sorc that can benefits armor/ES items,
Now that's a good Archmage.

What are you even talking about? There are builds with mace/shield Sorceress.

With Druid being released, there's tons of Armor/ES nodes all very close to Sorceress' starting point. The Disciple of Varashta ascendency specifically has a node that applies 60% of your current ES to apply to your Armor for physical damage reduction.

I'm playing a Sorceress right now using Armor/ES and I didn't even go with DoV for my ascendency. She's decently tanky. Armor/ES nodes are everywhere, just like going Evasion/ES on a Huntress or Ranger by traveling towards Monk's area of the tree.

yeah but something directly within the sorceress area, would be good. There are plenty of ES nodes everywhere, but for me the armor/es nodes are far away.

Yeah the Disciple ES passives are really good, i prefer them vs any of the skills, I run Armor/ES on my fire mage.

I havn't seen an ES build with shield and mace before, I need to see this. That's such a crazy idea now I want to try it.

I mean, I guess I don't really get it, to me the nodes for Armor/ES kind of are right there; there's an entire cluster next to the MoM keystone even. It doesn't take all that much to wander towards Druid's side of the tree instead of pathing straight up. It's just about what direction you go. Sure, they'll be far away if you've already pathed straight up or drifted towards Monk, but the entire passive tree is opportunity cost.
It isn't like you're trying to get to all the EV or Armor/EV nodes by Mercenary/Ranger/Huntress. I only just hit level 40 and I have plenty of Armor/ES nodes taken, along with some pure ES. But I planned to do Armor/ES hybrid from the start.


Caveat/Disclaimer:
I'm not the most efficient player, efficiency and min/maxing isn't really my goal right now, so I'm not trying to make a claim that I'm doing it the "best" way because I'm well aware that I'm not, lol. But I haven't died once and I'm having fun. Just want to be clear that I'm not trying to tout the "right" way to do something.


That said... go for it! :D
I don't have any specific examples handy but I'm sure they're out there.
Campaign is easy enough that just about anything is viable at least through the Interludes.
Some basic understanding goes a long way; you can play this game in so many different ways. One of my favorite builds to play was a Necromancer Sorceress just because the Maraketh hate Necromancy. Was it as efficient as it could have been? Hell no. Was it fun? Absolutely 10/10. She even has an Abyssal spectre because the Maraketh also fought a war against the Abyssals in ancient times.
Doing silly things like that is one of my favorite things about this game.

Yeah i never really prioritize defense, I usually max damage and only compromise for mana or defense if it becomes a problem. I should try doing a tankier build and want to try necromancer as well. There is definitely a lot to explore, i cant wait for the next major patch.

When i get a chance i'll respec my fire mage to the druid side to test it out, it seems like committing to that side takes a lot of points though.

We already have a pure ES node built into the core,
on one side you have ES/Mana
on the other side you have more pure ES
I would like if that changed to ES/Armor

there's only ES recharge down the middle but would be nice if that was maxES/Recharge

What I think people do to find exploits is they'll reach max level or close,
and then respec to find an exploit like barrier invocation.

I just cant imagine a max ES build having that much damage output unless someone was already max level, and bought some div on 3rd party idk x)

As long as my damage is in a comfortable spot I like to make sure I'm keeping up on defenses. I'm probably a bit overly-cautious in that regard, but oh well! :P

Yeah, I was already committed to the leaning-Druid side of the tree so I was already spending my points there, it was my destination from the start, lol. I'm not like, doing exclusively the Druid side of the tree or anything, just pathing towards the nodes that are useful for my build in that direction since I was already over there anyway!

And I see what you mean by that now!
It's pure ES because Sorceress/Witch are the pure Int characters.
Druid (and later Templar I believe it was) are the Str/Int characters, so they get the starting nodes that are Armor/ES.
Idk, it makes sense to me, I start with spell damage over ES either way.

It's all about balance and trade-offs and finding what works for you and what you want to do with it I guess.
That said, I'm not disagreeing that the balance is off somewhere.

In endgame I definitely feel like prioritizing defense is so important. during the acts we can die as much as we want, its just the 1 shot bosses that become a problem.

I do the same thing and get whatever is convenient on the tree but for what i'v been doing everything I need in within the sorceress area.

I still think mages that build armor is awesome and looks cool,
imagine something like an iron archmage ascension, the ultimate badass wizard.

Plus fire sorceress takes a lot of STR for support gems, so it goes hand in hand with armor.

It would be awesome to wield a melee weapon with the fire mage since firebolt is such a slow projectile and can barely hit fast bosses. I think fire sorceress is under powered vs my lightning sorceress by a lot. I haven't tried any hybrid builds, only maxing 1 element.

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Taistelija#5483 a écrit :

First problem when comparing life+armour vs pure ES:

Lets say you have 15,000 energy shield (no damage reduction or mitigation, apart from 75% all resistances).
If you take 10,000 dmg physical hit it is 15,000-10,000 = 5,000 energy shield left

Same situation with armour, lets say you have 100,000 armour and 5,000 health
If you take 10,000 dmg the formula is:

Damage reduction vs 10,000 physical hit
= armour / (armour + 10x 10,000)
= 100,000 / (100,000 + 10x 10,000)
= 0.5
= 50%

so, 10,000 hit with 100,000 armour is 50% damage reduction which means the 10,000 physical hit gets -50% reduction --> 10,000 x 0.5 = 5,000 damage

And this character had 5,000 health so you would be dead 5,000-5,000 = 0

I'm fairly sure there's only one type of boss that can do a 10k phys hit (Monkey red slams) and only on higher +boss levels. If I recall correctly I've never been hit for more than 5k phys damage with no armour on base boss difficulty in lvl80 maps.

So a 10k phys hit is extremely rare.

What is usually killing players is combinations of: extra as fire/cold/lightning and -max res, resistance penetration and elemental weakness.

Also ground dots which I agree that there is no real defense against except having a big HP pool.

someone had complained that ES can tank boss hits.

if 1 shot boss hits are the problem and armor is so week against them,
that's a boss balance problem.

instead the Boss should do % of max total HP including life and shield, instead of flat massive damage, just for its 1 shot abilities.

because what does that mean to players who arent maxing shield or hp?
they just get 1 hit by the boss while on full hp.

I also agree and do not like the modifiers on waystones to give elemental damages to all the mobs despite what their class is.

Instead mobs should get a flat damage increase instead of % increase because it gives some of the mobs enormous 1 shot potential too.

something could be said about mob balance too and how many waystones mods are better/ worse depending on class.

that should be out the window, and the mobs should be doing what they are expected to, what trait is unique to the mob, not a blanket buff.
(Unless its flat damage or HP)

Look at the Nodes for ES scaling

Look at the Nodes for Life scaling

Its a 1:15 ratio....

For every 15 ES Nodes to scale off of, Theres 1 max life node, Each of those max life nodes? 3% Increase

Look at the %Increase Nodes for ES, including faster recharge rate etc, compare that to the Life nodes and Regen nodes

There is such a massive gap its unbelievable how atrocious of a state ES/Life scaling is. infact, ES is legit broken being able to scale it to these ridiculous amounts... Have seen upwards of 100k ES.....

Its laughable, the only way to survive in this game is ES, the recharge rate is significantly higher then life, plenty of ways to reduce the recharge delay

Its baffling how this game was released into EA with such glaring issues that are gonna persist long into EA

And the quote from Devs regarding this matter?

"well we are scared too many players will prioritize the life nodes and get ridiculous amounts of HP and that's broken in our eyes"

While making the ES scaling nodes 10x the amount of life....
Adding a plethora of ways to scale this ES + Recharge + Delays

Life is not comparable in its current state, Just run Chaos Innoculation + ES untill this atrocious state of game is fixed, and ES is nerfed along with more Life nodes being Introduced

Look at the POE1 Skill tree, Notice the amount of Life nodes there compared to POE2's tree?

Its astonishing :/