RIP Bisco's?

Now here's also another key factor into the equation of biscos.

The sextant mobs vault was like what? 8? Let me get an SS



So lets list things of key factors

1) Sextants
2) Sustain
3) The map layout what div cards drop from it alright? We good
4) Zana 8 Breach

Sextants = More white mobs obviously

Biscos contributed to number 1 and 3 with 4 being the most important one.

You loss the ability to sustain shaped maps without sextants because if you don't finish your atlas YOU CAN'T DO MAX SEXTANTS.

Buying maps is a LARGE net loss as it is so number 2 is effectively dead killing shapes farming completely in terms of sustainability

You also lose another X additional sextants since it's 5 max now

AND NUMBER 4 ZANA 8 holy fucking shit that's like basically being shot in the face legs.

Overall the damage to biscos + the system right now = net loss completely.

"

awright a écrit :

"

I_NO a écrit :

Do you even know how shit works? =/ It's not the best anymore not even by a long shot dude lol

Legacy IIQ on an amulet goes upto 20% iirc

The bino's gave upto 100% on the current(Abyss) iteration, the nerfed version is going down to 50%

Thats not an outright half as effective nerf, thats only maybe a 33% overall effectiveness nerf when taking diminishing returns into account

if going for an outright IIQ build, tell me why an amulet giving approximately 35% IIQ (After diminishing returns) isnt better than one that gives 16% ?

Do you even know how shit works bro ?


[edit]
Waiting for the all caps dogshit deflection reply, oh and sun's data to prove his argument too

Actually, why not.

https://imgur.com/a/dZ92v I run 120 normal yellow maps with 0 quantity, no zana mods, no prophecies, no sextants, nothing at all. One bunch with Bisco and the other with 51% IIQ gear. Bisco corresponds to 42% IIQ here.

does anyone know if current bisco becomes legacy item or will stats be changed?

"

LowBudget780 a écrit :

"

g4merguy a écrit :

does anyone know if current bisco becomes legacy item or will stats be changed?

if I were a betting man I would go with retroactive nerf.

No, it's just a numbers change, it will be legacy.

"

LowBudget780 a écrit :

if I were a betting man I would go with retroactive nerf.

I bet on the opposite. It's a headache to retroactively change multiple items with percentage based values which vary, downscaling them in a fair manner.

This is gonna stay as is, there's no other way around.

"

I_NO a écrit :

Very severe.

You're better off using a shaped IIQ amulet or replace a piece of gear with pure IIQ.

Whatever the case is or what you do Biscos is simply not worth using anymore the net loss is way too much.

How much more IIQ do you get from shaper's 10% IIQ amulet?

I think rolling of shaper's gold amulet with high enough ilvl to get quantity and rarity is hard. So Biscos is still best option.

Either you use a shaped amulet or replace a piece of your gear with an IIQ basically. It's an all out net loss whatever you do with biscos.

Not to mention key points in my upper post lets go over again

1) Loss of zana Breach
2) Loss of sustain because you can't max sextant therefor you can't sustain shaped farming ''U CAN JUST BUY IT'' that's a net loss that's the point lol and a very large one. You can't infinite sustain without max'ing your Atlas that's gone
3) Max of 5 sextants

So the white mobs via biscos? Yeah that's kinda fucked you compensate via everything else that's the point.

See I'd be more mad if I know you made more of focused on my wealth on killing mobs etc but I trade.

I trade and trade
and trade
n trade
n trade
n trade
n trade

not to mention I direct on my groups trade as well

Personally I wanted improvements to the sextant system not nerfs I liked finding my shit. I truly did love that.

You really think I like trading? Naw hell you don't like trading we both don't like it.

Shit is stupid.

Well, they sure did a great job of gutting Bisco's Collar and leaving it to die.

Some of my thoughts about this nerf, as the creator of the Bisco's uniques:

It is funny in a way that during the item creation process GGG actually suggested the original Bisco’s Collar stats to me, rather than me pushing for some OP item. I had wanted an item that rewarded killing normal (or at least non-boss) monsters, and that might synergize well with items like Windripper and Cameria's Maul that provide conditional IIQ/IIR bonuses that are easier to apply when killing normal/magic enemies. The balance team assured me the suggested stats (150iir/100iiq) were balanced, and they looked great to me (having a three digit roll has a nice pscyhological effect to me). The reason the individual stats could be so high was because they were a) conditional and b) balanced around the item having literally no other stats to speak of. The lack of non-IIQ/IIR stats was both an opportunity cost as well as a justification for letting the amulet be really, really good at the one thing it actually does such that it could potentially compete with some of the other super powerful amulets already available in game. Anyway, seeing stats I liked and that the item did what I wanted (reward killing normal monsters and not bosses), I agreed to it as the final version.

If I knew the item would end up like it is now - uninspiring and barely an alternative to the Ascetic - I’d never have agreed to the stats. Instead, I’d have pushed for entirely different mods. Maybe the current mods but scaled by rampage kills to more directly pair it with Bisco’s Leash. I would have wanted something more unique at any rate if the item was going to be reduced to 'meh' level stats. For context, during the design process I had suggested things like “dropped item's socket rolls are lucky”, "you gain IIQ/IIR bonus for X seconds after you kill a rare enemy", and "your currency drops are lucky", but all of these were rejected. Perhaps those would have all been too overpowered, but at the end of the day I wanted something that rewarded players, made them make a meaningful choice in gearing (do I go for more mf or more damage/defense), and that provided most/all of its bonuses to non-boss contexts.

At this point, I don’t feel happy or remotely proud when I look at the revised Bisco’s Collar stats. Given the huge percentage of players that used the amulet, some kind of nerf was probably in order. However, with Shaper amulets getting IIQ rolls, sextant blocking being nerfed, breach and abyss being super rare, and the Bisco’s Collar nerf being so drastic, I don’t see Bisco's Collar as being particularly desirable or viable at this point. Maybe I am wrong, we will see. But it feels like a heavy-handed nerf (maybe 65-75% IIQ would have been better?), and a nerf that was based on Bisco’s Collar’s synergy with conditions (sextant blocking, Zana breach) that can’t even be readily achieved anymore.

The amount of sheer joy about the nerf indicates GGG did what vocal people wanted - nerf Bisco’s Collar into the ground. Again, maybe I am wrong here, but it certainly feels like in the process they also neutered (yes, Bisco was neutered in real life too) it to a point of being one of the last individual mf gear pieces most players will choose. It likely has less of an impact than people using Goldwyrm or Sadima's, and it doesn't have the additional stats that Perandus Blazon, Bisco's Leash, and Ventor's Gamble provide. During the design process I had wanted something that could be effectively used by itself, like Bisco’s Leash can for the rampage and some bonus mf stats. That was the whole reason it has no non-mf stats, unlike most other mf items - to make it a compelling choice for mf that can be used alone or alongside other mf items it has to compete with the defensive/offensive power of things like Xoph's Blood. Now Bisco’s Collar seems to be trash in a vacuum, and only worth it if you are min-maxing IIQ AND you are meeting a few specific conditions for spawning normal monsters. All of which suggests there is no way in hell anyone chooses it over just about any other mf item if they are looking to add just a piece or two to their setup.

=( hi bisco creator

~hug

Can't you contact Chris? It is your money lol be more forceful.

Skyforth did
Charan did

You should too.

"

I_NO a écrit :

=( hi bisco creator

~hug

Can't you contact Chris? It is your money lol be more forceful.

Skyforth did
Charan did

You should too.

Overdue nerf imo. maybe ziz will finally shut up about how good bisco is and how it locks your amulet slot :)