Chris Wilson: "I want to make sure that melee classes are as good as they can be"

I play a lot of melee using cleave. The end game can be tough. I'd like to see a change that made close combat be more effective Having to stand right next to a boss should earn melee bonuses for doing so. Weaker boss defenses would be nice or greater susceptibility to things like bleed or poison or curses. Maybe knock back could be more effective at keeping the boss inactive for a time.

As a casual player, I am not rich and it seems that my really good weapon choices are pretty limited. Rigwald's sword/ax set and WoE seem to be the most effective that are readily available. I'd like to see more high dps swords and axes that can be scaled with other gear and gems.

"

charley222 a écrit :

1- physical melee have less skill gem vs range and caster mean less option

Idk man... You even played 3.0?

Melee physical damage
brutality
maim
ruthless
damage on full life
faster attacks
multistrike
chance to bleed (flat phys)
inc AoE/conc effect
critical strikes/crit multi
bloodlust

... I could easily fill a 12 Link for my main attack, and that's only damage, not even considering pure QoL supports.

"

3- front line melee have very limited armor choice belly of the beast or Kaom's Heart or your low life build will you die vs monster explosion Oo

When I remove my Kaom's Heart and put on a 100 life chest, I still have ~7500 life.
When I put on a belly instead of a 100 life chest, I only gain minimal extra life, around 200?

"

6- the game have elemental damage armor buff Molten Shell (fire) but still nothing for physical Oo

Does it really matter what type of damage MS does? You use that thing for the flat armour, if at all.

---

"

keeperofstars a écrit :

It has 7k life, 45% damage reduction a rumi's to bring block up to 35% (...) Max resist and I do 70-100k DPS a second. And i have fortify for 20% flat damage reduction across the board.

70-100k DpS is really low these days. Like super low.

Also, your 45% (physical) damage reduction is pretty worthless against uber atziri.

---

"

e1337donkey a écrit :

It's not so much tankiness that melee need. It's more how a ton of the skills function. So many skills require a melee swing to land and it just doesn't work in the endgame very well.

Imho, the biggest issue "true" melee has is "horrible namelocking".

I played a viper striking gladiator to around 90-92 in legacy league.
He was survivable, damage was fine, could beat all content I had access to...
But even with the "improvements", namelocking is still terrible.

It's somewhat okay when you click on a slow zombie (still bad QoL), but once you need to click on a fast moving monster with a super little hitbox (like those dried lake spider thingies, or even the fleeing apes), namelock melee starts to be outright unplayable.
Even with multistrike, it starts to be a pain in the ass.

The main reason I always gravitate towards true AoE melee skills like (Cleave, Sunder, Cyclone) is to circumvent this horrible namelocking system. I can just click in the general direction on a monster, and see it die.

Lower clearspeed, compared to true ranged builds - I can deal with this. I don't really care.
Need to be close to monsters - Non-issue to me, with most "ranged" builds, I also facetank.

Well Melee skills as Chris referred to in the above quote - so Cyclone, Sunder, Earthquake and the likes - are in a good spot nowadays imho.
If as Melee you intend Heavy Strike, GH and all namelock melee skills, well... 'nuff said.

How to "fix" the latter without "making op" the first?? I don't have an answer, and I suspect neither has GGG...

"

Wazz72 a écrit :

How to "fix" the latter without "making op" the first?? I don't have an answer, and I suspect neither has GGG...

That's simple enough, I suppose, Grim Dawn is an even clunkier game than PoE but it's nothing short of wonderful where can a good namelocking system and high rewards for doing it get you.

"

Wazz72 a écrit :

Well Melee skills as Chris referred to in the above quote - so Cyclone, Sunder, Earthquake and the likes - are in a good spot nowadays imho.
If as Melee you intend Heavy Strike, GH and all namelock melee skills, well... 'nuff said.

How to "fix" the latter without "making op" the first?? I don't have an answer, and I suspect neither has GGG...

I'd turn half of them into support gems.
This treatment is applied to skills that have little to no use at all.

Dual Strike -> Dual Strike (support): linked melee attack skill uses both weapons at 50-70% of their damage.

Heavy Strike + Stun support -> Heavy Blows (support): a bit of % more melee damage, a lot of reduced stun treshold

Double Strike = multistrike, just remove DS.

Glacial Hammer -> Shatter support: chance to freeze, culling frozen monsters, 25% phys to cold, 15-35% more cold damage

(...)

For the other half, I'd just remove the namelocking.
Instead of this stupid "fix" for melee, make the game autotarget a monster somewhere around me in weapon range, whenever I rightclick. When I mouse over a monster, make this monster the preferred target of my attack.

"

TreeOfDead a écrit :

What you suggest? My opinion melee needs some extra defense that non melee cant have and more melee only support gems.

They tried doing that with Fortify, fucked up, everyone got it and now seem to be too afraid to take it away again.

"

Peterlerock a écrit :

"

Wazz72 a écrit :

Well Melee skills as Chris referred to in the above quote - so Cyclone, Sunder, Earthquake and the likes - are in a good spot nowadays imho.
If as Melee you intend Heavy Strike, GH and all namelock melee skills, well... 'nuff said.

How to "fix" the latter without "making op" the first?? I don't have an answer, and I suspect neither has GGG...

I'd turn half of them into support gems.
This treatment is applied to skills that have little to no use at all.

Dual Strike -> Dual Strike (support): linked melee attack skill uses both weapons at 50-70% of their damage.

Heavy Strike + Stun support -> Heavy Blows (support): a bit of % more melee damage, a lot of reduced stun treshold

Double Strike = multistrike, just remove DS.

Glacial Hammer -> Shatter support: chance to freeze, culling frozen monsters, 25% phys to cold, 15-35% more cold damage

(...)

For the other half, I'd just remove the namelocking.
Instead of this stupid "fix" for melee, make the game autotarget a monster somewhere around me in weapon range, whenever I rightclick. When I mouse over a monster, make this monster the preferred target of my attack.

Nice suggestions, the support gems in particular. +1

"

Peterlerock a écrit :

"

Wazz72 a écrit :

Well Melee skills as Chris referred to in the above quote - so Cyclone, Sunder, Earthquake and the likes - are in a good spot nowadays imho.
If as Melee you intend Heavy Strike, GH and all namelock melee skills, well... 'nuff said.

How to "fix" the latter without "making op" the first?? I don't have an answer, and I suspect neither has GGG...

I'd turn half of them into support gems.
This treatment is applied to skills that have little to no use at all.

Dual Strike -> Dual Strike (support): linked melee attack skill uses both weapons at 50-70% of their damage.

Heavy Strike + Stun support -> Heavy Blows (support): a bit of % more melee damage, a lot of reduced stun treshold

Double Strike = multistrike, just remove DS.

Glacial Hammer -> Shatter support: chance to freeze, culling frozen monsters, 25% phys to cold, 15-35% more cold damage

(...)

For the other half, I'd just remove the namelocking.
Instead of this stupid "fix" for melee, make the game autotarget a monster somewhere around me in weapon range, whenever I rightclick. When I mouse over a monster, make this monster the preferred target of my attack.

Why not do that the other way around?

Make Sunder a support, so when you link it to Heavy Strike, a wave flows from the namelocked target towards other enemies, and further generates shock waves.

Make Earthquake a support, so an enemy hit with Dual Strike will be pounded so hard, that the further explosion of earth will be actually warranted by your sheer force of impact.

And so on.

If you enjoy playing ranged melee, please transition to ranged characters.

If you enjoy AoE spamming, please go caster.

But for the love of God Almighty, leave us "scrubs" that want to have visceral impact, no matter how many enemies we're fighting at a time, be them 1 boss, or hordes of normal "pinatas", just with a style that forces us into that cool 16 radius of the enemy, where "you smell monster armpits to do damage"...

Let us feel like the ascending Gods that PoE entices us to be through the new revamped story, not some sissies that clear entire screens with a swing, without paying attention to where we target (those other 2 options already do that, on absurd levels at time, may I add)...

Let us embody the might, the power and the destruction that "MELEE" as a playstyle should warrant...

PS: I also don't mind further improvements to targeting, but I still want "melee" to have time to "think" about attacking certain enemies, so a default focus on the closest enemy in proximity might not always be the answer, although in most situations would be a boon, and even entice Multistrike's removal/further rework...

"

Peterlerock a écrit :

"

charley222 a écrit :

1- physical melee have less skill gem vs range and caster mean less option

Idk man... You even played 3.0?

Melee physical damage
brutality
maim
ruthless
damage on full life
faster attacks
multistrike
chance to bleed (flat phys)
inc AoE/conc effect
critical strikes/crit multi
bloodlust

... I could easily fill a 12 Link for my main attack, and that's only damage, not even considering pure QoL supports.

Spoiler

"

3- front line melee have very limited armor choice belly of the beast or Kaom's Heart or your low life build will you die vs monster explosion Oo

When I remove my Kaom's Heart and put on a 100 life chest, I still have ~7500 life.
When I put on a belly instead of a 100 life chest, I only gain minimal extra life, around 200?

"

6- the game have elemental damage armor buff Molten Shell (fire) but still nothing for physical Oo

Does it really matter what type of damage MS does? You use that thing for the flat armour, if at all.

---

"

keeperofstars a écrit :

It has 7k life, 45% damage reduction a rumi's to bring block up to 35% (...) Max resist and I do 70-100k DPS a second. And i have fortify for 20% flat damage reduction across the board.

70-100k DpS is really low these days. Like super low.

Also, your 45% (physical) damage reduction is pretty worthless against uber atziri.

---

"

e1337donkey a écrit :

It's not so much tankiness that melee need. It's more how a ton of the skills function. So many skills require a melee swing to land and it just doesn't work in the endgame very well.

Imho, the biggest issue "true" melee has is "horrible namelocking".

I played a viper striking gladiator to around 90-92 in legacy league.
He was survivable, damage was fine, could beat all content I had access to...
But even with the "improvements", namelocking is still terrible.

It's somewhat okay when you click on a slow zombie (still bad QoL), but once you need to click on a fast moving monster with a super little hitbox (like those dried lake spider thingies, or even the fleeing apes), namelock melee starts to be outright unplayable.
Even with multistrike, it starts to be a pain in the ass.

The main reason I always gravitate towards true AoE melee skills like (Cleave, Sunder, Cyclone) is to circumvent this horrible namelocking system. I can just click in the general direction on a monster, and see it die.[

Lower clearspeed, compared to true ranged builds - I can deal with this. I don't really care.
Need to be close to monsters - Non-issue to me, with most "ranged" builds, I also facetank.spoiler]

sorry but before trying to show me how to link 12 support gem , try to have better read and understand of what i`m saying , i never talk about support gem but skill gem , just 1 quick comparison for the melee limitation option, if your character hold 1 2hand axe your only dps option is Vaal Cyclone oO now go look and compare all dps vaal spell caster have Oo anyway i know already i waste my time ,


i think something like Indomitable need to be add on templar(maybe 10%)and Duelist(15% to 20%)side ( reduced Extra Damage from Critical Strikes) or idk just buff a bit Indomitable

just get 1 shot again t13 map got 7k heal 22k def using pot def go to 46k -81% all res cap -20% crit damage take
and get 1 shot map mods are just so no sense broken over the top [IMG]http://i67.tinypic.com/25swo0g.png[/IMG] , no choice to range in this broken game my last 5 or 6 map i craft are just insane crazy mods :( i take one and die

"

Chris a écrit :

I've frequently gone back to playing melee classes in Path of Exile, and this is partly because I want to make sure that they're as good as they can be, but also because I really like the Cyclone skill. And so while Cyclone characters often turn into Sunder characters and so on, I do typically resonate with melee characters.

Y'all taking Chris' comments seriously and trying to write lengthy "feedback" lol, smh.