We still need more active skill slots - 7 skills for 24 sockets doesnt cut it

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Antnee a écrit :

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SVD a écrit :

WOW had an interface with 9058409894 buttons and shortcuts via all ctrl alt shift etc imagineable and it seems to have worked there.

D2 had 12 slots for the at most 10 skills that you actively wanted to use (@Raics i dont think i ever ran out of hotkeys to use in d2 ;D)

Is that really... really an example you want to use here?

WOW is a game where you level a character, use a multitude of skills and have an interface to use them.

To me the comparison sounds applicable.

I have never played WOW myself (only a look over the shoulder when watching friends play), but the interface seemingly did its job of letting players use their skills.

If you want another example:

In borderlands you have 4 weaponslots. Most of the time you will want to use only 2 of the weapons, but in some emergency situations you have access to another 2 weapons (e.g. for a rocket launcher or for a shotgun for second wind situations). No problem there. i can carry around 30 weapons there but only equip 4.

In poe i can equip 10+ (and almost always use 9+) but have to click,search,click,click,search,click to cast one of the spells 8-10 once.

Edit: sorry I misread, thought this was about socket availability not the hotbar. The hotbar having more slots or being able to switch to a separate list would be great.

Strange idea, but what if you could put active skill gems in jewel sockets?

There could also be a new gear slot, such as pants, that have no stats other than attribute requirements but have sockets. 2 3-links that run down your legs for example.

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SVD a écrit :

WOW is a game where you level a character, use a multitude of skills and have an interface to use them.

To me the comparison sounds applicable.

Not really, in MMOs you aren't putting just skills on action bar, you use it for shortcuts to potions, actions like disarm trap or pickpocket, single or multi-use items, interface elements like crafting or even emotes for communicating to other players.

Comparison is miles off, it's the same as comparing PoE to a full rpg like neverwinter nights where you typically got 10-12 slots in multiple rows, and you need them. Action RPGs are much simpler, the norm is 8 to 12 slots and some, like Sacred, have only five, plus buff slots on the side.

The idea of an Unset Belt seems great on paper, but in practice I don't think there's a meaningful choice to be made there -- ignoring two of the corrupted mods, belt implicits simply can't measure up to two sockets. Limiting them to one socket could be interesting.

The developers themselves want to encourage the option of using more multiple skills in builds. This is EXPLICITLY stated in the awakening page in the text about that "increased damage towards bleeding enemies" gem.

If they want to encourage us having the option using a larger varieties of skills within the same build (which they clearly STATED they do with that gem's hype text), they should give us more active skill hotkey slots to actually fit those skills in.

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raics a écrit :

A non-summoner build probably doesn't need more and that's usually the amount we can support ptoperly, if socket numbers aren't increasing there's little reason to supersize action bar.

That's simply not true. I run into problems with not having enough keybinds on almost every build I make (and I never make summoners), and that's even considering the fact that (when using an attack-based character) i change my default attack to an attack skill, effectively giving me an eighth bind.


My build in the 1m league used to use spectral throw on Q, immortal call on W, Enduring Cry on E, Cyclone on R, Flickerstrike on T, Static Strike on LMB instead of a default attack, Warlord's Mark on MMB, and Decoy Totem on RMB. Additionally, at the start of session I've gotta temporarily swap out one of those binds to activate HoA and Hatred, and once Awakening hits I'll probably wanna have a Fire Golem tossed in somewhere.


It's not quite so packed anymore (dropped IC, moved Warlord's Mark to the back to take Vaal DD with), but even my back weapon set doesn't actually have enough room for everything now, I've gotta swap out binds to use my portal gem.




Which reminds me, not only would it be nice to have more active slots, it'd be really nice if the game would remember the active setups for both weapon sets completely separately, and remember when a skill gem is replacing the default left mouse button attack.

It's so annoying that if I ever unsocket a skill (or weapon swap it off, if it's socketed in a weapon/shield) that I've bound on my left mouse button, when i resocket the skill the game won't rebind it to that position... it basically means I can't EVER bind a skill that's socketed into my weapon to the left mouse button, or else its bind will be mucked up the moment i weapon swap.

And as to the other half of that, as an example to illustrate it: Say I've got Cyclone bound to the R button, and socketed into my chest (so it's available to both weapon sets), but I only actually care about using it on my front weapon set. Then say I've got Leap Slam socketed into my back weapon set (in a Brightbeak), and I want it also bound to R whenever I'm on my back weapon set, as I don't care about using Cyclone with that set. Right now? I can't do that, because if I bind Cyclone to R while on my front set, it forces Cyclone to be R on my back set too. Again, very annoying, and frankly rather restricting of how many skill I can actively use.

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Shppy a écrit :

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raics a écrit :

A non-summoner build probably doesn't need more and that's usually the amount we can support ptoperly, if socket numbers aren't increasing there's little reason to supersize action bar.

That's simply not true.

Which reminds me, not only would it be nice to have more active slots, it'd be really nice if the game would remember the active setups for both weapon sets completely separately, and remember when a skill gem is replacing the default left mouse button attack.

That's up to personal preference, yes, and you also use so many skills out of personal preference. You don't 'need' so many on a standard attacker or caster build and summoners often do require them to play up to their full potential, they just have more situational skills than other builds.

And about the other thing, I agree completely, the game should just remember what was socketed in which slot instead of playing a smartass with us.

For the longest time, sockets felt like they were infinite. Auras came along and ate up some of the sockets, but there was still some left over. CwDT/CwS passive linkages were a huge amount of free power because most builds filled their leftover sockets with yet more passive buffs.

Nowadays, if GGG were to add a gem that said, say, +10 maximum life, it would actually be an interesting tradeoff to decide if it's worth it to give up all or part of a mobility or auto-casting linkage directly for some of those stats. Not to say that they are planning this at all, but sockets, as a resource, are now scarce. New content that uses sockets has to compete against all others.

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Keybinds are just yet another resource that we are just now starting to realize (and it's closely related to number of sockets). Summoners are the first to hit this because of the number of 1L-2L "useful" binds since most builds can't make much use out of, say, a 1L Convocation. Assuming that it's possible to get more than 8 useful active skill gems into your 24/26/whatever sockets, you'll have to start picking and choosing which ones to really use.

It's nice to be a summoner that can throw out zombies, skeletons, spectres, srs, animated weapons, a guardian, a golem, curse some enemies, runs a toggleable buff, and maybe cast a spell or two, but this may be GGG's unsubtle way to force people to pick and choose what they want the character to do. No one character can do it all at the same time.

In the future, GGG could keep adding extremely strong, limited duration buffs and skills (like more Fortify sources, a different kind of buff like Blood Rage, whatever) knowing that it will start becoming a tradeoff with having a decoy totem or a golem or what-have-you.

If anything, this implies that Summoners are already hitting that limit and that other classes need similar useful 1L-2L skills so that every build is at resource parity. Golems are a good example of something that most characters can just slap on as a 2L (with Minion Life) to get its buff (and babysit it a little). The totem changes may also be pushing us toward that.

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Shppy a écrit :

Which reminds me, not only would it be nice to have more active slots, it'd be really nice if the game would remember the active setups for both weapon sets completely separately, and remember when a skill gem is replacing the default left mouse button attack.

It's so annoying that if I ever unsocket a skill (or weapon swap it off, if it's socketed in a weapon/shield) that I've bound on my left mouse button, when i resocket the skill the game won't rebind it to that position... it basically means I can't EVER bind a skill that's socketed into my weapon to the left mouse button, or else its bind will be mucked up the moment i weapon swap.

And as to the other half of that, as an example to illustrate it: Say I've got Cyclone bound to the R button, and socketed into my chest (so it's available to both weapon sets), but I only actually care about using it on my front weapon set. Then say I've got Leap Slam socketed into my back weapon set (in a Brightbeak), and I want it also bound to R whenever I'm on my back weapon set, as I don't care about using Cyclone with that set. Right now? I can't do that, because if I bind Cyclone to R while on my front set, it forces Cyclone to be R on my back set too. Again, very annoying, and frankly rather restricting of how many skill I can actively use.

Fixing this alone would be MASSIVE for the game, allowing a huge amount more dynamic gameplay. It's seriously one of the biggest issues but has swept under the radar for years.

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pneuma a écrit :

but this may be GGG's unsubtle way to force people to pick and choose what they want the character to do. No one character can do it all at the same time.

Regarding the fact that you can switch abilities 8+ in and out i don't think that this is anything but a temporary solution right now.

if they want you to have just 7 abilities, why can you switch them out?
if they want you to have just 7 active abilities, why not just activate any passive abilities by default?
if they want you to be able to use all socketed abilities in your items, why just provide the players with 7 active skill slots?