POE2 currently misses the right balance...

Crafting in PoE2 is one of the worst . Who invented this system?
Is like you depend in 99.9% on Trade or very VERY lucky drop like one per million.

They had an opportunity to improve on the crafting system by, for instance, having a vendor that shows vendor recipes and you just have to provide the 'ingredients' to craft the items (still with some randomness).

Base + currency + modifiers = items.

Or like Einhar: gather right things, get ilvl unique etc.

Yet they chose "make it like PoE 1" but remove most of it. Was it to force everyone onto the market?

I cannot believe the lack of innovation we've ended up with for PoE2 for basic things. I suppose it's partly because it was originally part of PoE1, but also it seems most time was spent on WASD/weapon swap, and weapon swap loses out to screen clear zip zip anyway.

"

Radonegsky#6656 a écrit :

but not through the introduction of such point measures as a special currency for SSF.

But as I said, the suggestion can also have an effect on the market. It may be considered sufficient, especially if you choose the correct GEO/EO course.

I think you misunderstood me here.....my suggestion shouldn't be SSF exclusive.

The keyword here is "multiple options".

Some ofc hate crafting and rather buy all theyr stuff on the market....that's perfectly fine.

Others on the other hand like to craft all theyr gear on theyr own and progress theyr character this way....for this kind of playerbase things like a "crafting bench" or "Greater Exalted Orbs" would come very handy, so everyone can build up his character the way he likes the most.

As said....Multiple options, the game shouldn't limit everyone to trade and torture those who don't want to deal with it via an extrenal website.

Plus with my suggestions trading would still be superior, it just adds more options for those who don't want to trade for whatever reason (Scams, Dupes f.e....or simply the satisfaction to progress the char on theyr own)

And the current situation in POE2 (means having 0 consistency because of the lack of crafting options) is already affecting the market.

1 Divine is already over 300 Exalts and most of the decent items cost 20 Div+.....this means if you don't belong to those who play POE2 24/7 as theyr job, you'll probably leave the game frustrated after a very short time.

And don't undestand me wrong....I know how to make currency and wouldn't have problems with such absurd market, but surely 90% of the playerbase don't and that's very bad for the longlivity of a game and therefore also bad for me as a core player.

Esp when all my friends leave the game out of frustration, because they have close to 0 character progress even after 100 hours in endgame and don't want to deal with poe.trade.

"

They had an opportunity to improve on the crafting system by, for instance, having a vendor that shows vendor recipes and you just have to provide the 'ingredients' to craft the items (still with some randomness).

I mean I understand it's Early Access and many things haven't been added yet, but they could have added just a little bit consistency into the game so it doesen't feel like a broken slot machine where you're not able to win.....Even if it's a temporeraly solution till we get a propper crafting system.

All my newbie friends asked me the same after 100 hours without any upgrades...."what do I have to do to get better gear if I don't want to use poe.trade?"

But I understand theyr frustration and why they don't play anymore....I mean who want's to spend 100ts of hours in a game without geting rewarded outside of poe.trade.

Imagine picking up 1000ts of items, going the tedious proccess to even pick up and gamble white and blue items only to get nothing back after all the hard work.

That's not fun and very demotivating....becasue I doubt that my next 5000 white, blue and yellow items that I pick up and gamble will have better results than the previous ones due to the current item system in POE2.

And yes, maybe the dopamine is over the top if you gamble 1 more or less "good" item after 5000 trash items....but this 5-6 seconds dopamine can't cover up the 100 hours frustration before the 1 decent drop/gamble.

Enjoying this thread and the perspectives. I’m an older player as well and also a lifelong gamer. I primarily play on console, although I also bought early access for the PC as well. I was absolutely addicted while leveling my monk. Now I’m level 75 and doing tier 7 maps. I have been trying to play without buying anything, partially for reasons of pride but also partially because it means I have to go sit at my desk. My gaming buddy dropped out around act 3 because he couldn’t figure out how to make his infernalist work and the build guides in his words “don’t tell you what to do to get to that level.”

My daughter has 1000’s of hours in POE and has told me that GGG is repeating all of the same mistakes because they kept the teams separate so they wouldn’t influence each other, which is so dumb I would have thought Pete Parsons came up with it. Extended early access hasn’t done anything except drive hyperinflation near as I can tell. I’m considering rolling something else, but y’all are saying that there will be a league restart soon and I’ve already played the same set of maps twice.

I don’t mind hard. Although it sucks losing xp and a map, it definitely makes me sit up and pay attention when it’s go time. To balance that out, though, I want to know how I died. Not why, just how. I’m dedicated enough that I will persist through some deaths if I can learn what’s happening. I even go so far as to clip my deaths and rewatch them, but if I have a dozen icons indicating buff and debuff and I haven’t learned what they are yet, I am not really learning anything. An in game replay, even if it’s just the last 100 entries in a combat log, would give me something.

I also think it’s unfortunate that the game is balanced around trading. GGG opened the door and invited console players in. Perhaps they regret this. The consequence of these decisions is that I can’t take advantage of the intended way to smooth out my progression. I don’t think an AH is a magic silver bullet, but I do think they were not really thinking about console players with the current set of tradeoffs.

Crafting. Again, because the game is balanced around trading gear, near as I can tell crafting is too. This is a double whammy because there are so many layers of RNG that it’s the definition of insanity to try to craft your own gear. I’m doing it anyway to learn, but I haven’t even encountered any of the late game essences. You can have a lot of RNG and it won’t feel arbitrary if the crafting systems can be made more deterministic, but when those also have a high amount of randomness…well it doesn’t feel like crafting very much.

Finally, the overall new player experience. Again I want to reiterate that I like difficult content. The in game documentation is copious and yet somehow manages to be largely unhelpful. Vast amounts of knowledge that I don’t really get an on-ramp for. And before you say “Youtube” I could not for the life of me find a creator who had taken the time to explain what a breech ring was and why it was so good. Finally found a random short (thank you Miso!) that explained it. I imagine no creator had ever thought to explain it because they forgot it needed explaining. Everyone says armor is bad. How am I supposed to be able to tell that? I still honestly don’t understand how half of the things work or don’t work together, and I’ve been watching several videos and even have started playing around with Path of Building.

I am intentionally not going to say anything about the big spikey tiger trap that is in the chasm between act 3 merciless and the end game, aside from it’s there and it sucks and it is exacerbated by many of these other factors.

I have nothing but respect for the exile vets and I’m sorry GGG has shat upon you so. I think they have made a big mistake by irritating their core fan base, and the industry should be learning from examples like Bungie studios and not emulating them. I am not asking to be catered to, and I know tradeoffs need to made. Since this thread is fairly mellow I wanted to share my take on the tradeoffs as I see them. I’ll be back for Acts 4-6 if the leveling is anywhere near as good. But end game POE may just not be for me, and I guess that’s ok. But if it’s not for filthy casuals, and the vets don’t like it either… well who is it for?

Poe2

Is a beautiful limousine, slick , with a stocked bar.

It also has a guy named Archie that comes with the car.
He has the heat cranked.

He doesn't wear deodorant, sweat is pouring off his face dripping
onto the tuna garlic melt he is stuffing his face with.

The limo pulls away and you are trapped in the back with Archie .
The intercom to the driver is broken.
The windows wont roll down in this limo version.

Archie keeps farting and tuna belching as he moves to your side of the car.
Greasy fingers offering you a bite of his sandwich ...

If only you could get rid of your nemesis Archie.

PoE2

"

Jitter912#4278 a écrit :

Poe2

Is a beautiful limousine, slick , with a stocked bar.

It also has a guy named Archie that comes with the car.
He has the heat cranked.

He doesn't wear deodorant, sweat is pouring off his face dripping
onto the tuna garlic melt he is stuffing his face with.

The limo pulls away and you are trapped in the back with Archie .
The intercom to the driver is broken.
The windows wont roll down in this limo version.

Archie keeps farting and tuna belching as he moves to your side of the car.
Greasy fingers offering you a bite of his sandwich ...

If only you could get rid of your nemesis Archie.

PoE2

That's f'ing hilarious.

"

Enjoying this thread and the perspectives.

it was also a pleasure for me to read your post, thanks for the nice comment. :)

"

I don’t mind hard. Although it sucks losing xp and a map, it definitely makes me sit up and pay attention when it’s go time.

Same here, have nothing agains hard if done propperly...sadly "hard" in POE2 currently means 1-hit or get 1-hit, there's nothing really inbetween if you don't invest crazy ammounts of currency in trade to get tons of ES.

And because of the XP/Map loss I've already made a suggestion in another thread, at least for the 1 portal rule...My idea would be to tie the 1 Portal rule to the Atlas Passive tree.

If you pick this passive tree you get 100% Item Rarity BUT only 1 Portal, double XP loss and you can even decrease in level when losing XP (High risk, high reward).

"

I also think it’s unfortunate that the game is balanced around trading. GGG opened the door and invited console players in.

Yup, that's the current problem....The game feels completely unrewarding without trading BUT with trading it becomes very trivial super fast.

I have a full trade Monk and I faceroll all content with around 5 Div investment into trading.

So I dacided to play without trading and got the other extreme, the experiance to play for many many of hours without any reward......both worlds need a propper balance to make POE2 more engaging.

"

Finally, the overall new player experience. Again I want to reiterate that I like difficult content. The in game documentation is copious and yet somehow manages to be largely unhelpful. Vast amounts of knowledge that I don’t really get an on-ramp for.

Yup the game is very overwhelimg for new players at first but all of my newbie friends learned very fast....I think if you play a game from the start it's easier to learn it than if you play it 1 year later f.e. at 1.0 release.

As a fanboy ofc I soak up every new information I find on the internet and share this knowledge with all my mates...One even asked me how I can save so much informations in my brain for all games we play together. XD

"

I am intentionally not going to say anything about the big spikey tiger trap that is in the chasm between act 3 merciless and the end game, aside from it’s there and it sucks and it is exacerbated by many of these other factors.

Where me an all my friends agree (no matter if new to ARPGs or VEterans like me) is that the best part in POE2 is the time where we've played Act 1-3 Normal for the first time.

The fights were meaningfull and the boss fights simply fun while monster not 1 hitting the character only by looking at you. XD

It was the best ARPG experiance I've ever had in my almost 3 decades as a gamer...by far.

I would wish myslef to have this Act1-3 Normal situation throughout all the game till the super late endgame and no matter if we invest 5 or 50.000 Divines into a build.

More investment should only come with more QOL, not being able to 1-tap the whole game and it's grandmother.

POE2 has such amazing boss designs, let us enjoy them even in very late endgame without the obligation to build our character to the point where we 1-tap everything because othervise the enemies 1-tap us.

Would wish the same for rares and even trashmobs....let trasmobs behave intelligent together with rares and give us interesting and meaningful fights this way.

F.e. shield skeletons in front protect mage skeletons and a healer behind them, while blue mob Occultist try to finish an ongoing ritual....And if you don't kill the Occultists fast enough they ressurect some kind of Miniboss who can make the fight a bit more challanging. ;)

Or Rhoas protecting a nest with charges and knockbacks and if you dont destroy the nest fast enough very fast & deadly hatchlings attack you (Because they're very hungry).

Give us exciting and meaningful fights please, not the current 1 hit fiesta we have....POE2 has so many amazing mob designs but currently they all feel kinda same esp in endgame, like 1-hit bowling pins.

"

Baglog#2513 a écrit :

Finally, the overall new player experience. Again I want to reiterate that I like difficult content. The in game documentation is copious and yet somehow manages to be largely unhelpful. Vast amounts of knowledge that I don’t really get an on-ramp for.

There is a problem here that I don't think many people realise. The guide you need (for PoE1 too) is not about how to build your stats and how skills work, it's for how modifiers on monsters work:

You need to know that any monster can kill you if it rolls a 'bad' modifier combo. Life leech, power charges, corrupted blood, reflected damage, curses, attack speed, increased phys damage, corpse explosions, etc, etc...

It's all those modifiers and all their combinations that GGG put no balance control over whatsoever that can turn a steamroll into insta-death. It really picks up when you hit maps and there's no guide for new players on how to avoid it, and there's no easy way to avoid it because it's hard to get those defensive stats.

If GGG could actually balance modifiers (or at least their scaling), everyone would have a smoother, more predictable experience. Instead we have '1000hr noobs' and 'PoE University' to try and figure it out, with experienced players just rolling map modifiers until one is 'doable.'

Not to mention the balance of mob type makeups and numbers which combine to quickly overwhelm the non-oneshotscreenwipe builds...

Well first big thing here is SSF. They're not going to make it feel worth your time because then a lot more people would play it. I would. That means they split their playerbase.

They consider when a player is crafting they're doing so for everyone. Personally I think their power allocation is way off. They're using addictive behavior as a means to keep the player going instead of giving them something more direct to work on to improve their character.

In Diablo 1 you could have two Warriors with identical gear but the one who put time into getting Teleport to level 20 through adventure is going to be notably stronger. ARPGs have forgotten their roots come from CRPGs and I feel the current state of both really shows that.

CRPGs are winning awards and making a come back while ARPGs are flopping over.