[Bug] Something is seriously wrong with loot (resolved with 0.10.7)

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TheAnuhart a écrit :

I encounter this randomly but can't say it has had anything to do with terrain.

I know for a fact I killed the Wharf boss smack bang in the middle of an open area and it dropped 1 blue and 2 whites only.

As for rare monsters, I find they drop nothing at all more than something, but this is with nothing special in regards to IIx.

Well from what I have seen, its extremely unlikely (if at all possible) for a rare mob in a map to drop no loot at all. The reason I refer to terrain, is because its the only thing that makes sense. I mean I have done a lot of tests (nothing more to do with 66 and 67 maps than to test theories anyway :P). And I know for a fact that on maps with dual unique bosses, if they are killed by the same person they drop the same exact amount of loot.

Item quantity (as in the amount of drops themselves) does not seem to be affected by RNG in the slightest. RNG only comes to play with item rarity. If you want an easy proof with this, do a few normal hillock kills w/o any quantity and then get your quantity to 50% and observe what you get. Its not random (or at least it was not for me).

The only part where quantity seems to be affected by RNG maybe is when you have a non 50% multiplicative quantity. As in with 170% quantity you might or might not get one extra item here or there. But the amount of drops can almost always be calculated with very minor error margin.

The problem that seems to come up repeatedly is that mobs that die in limited space will sometimes drop either no loot or far far less than expected. To me this does not seem to be directly impacted by the killing ability, quantity or rarity in the slightest. Again, did about 200 kills on Hillock normal with varying IIQ, IIR (at the same time a friend of mine was doing the same so we got double the amount of results for those tests of ours). During those runs, hillock never, ever dropped 0 loot, and he always dropped the expected amount of drops +/- 1.

The reason I am leaning towards terrain being an issue is very simple. Any boss/rare mob killed extremely close to a wall (or stairs/pillars/in general any terrain impassable object) will most likely result in lost loot. Now, if you are seeing on average 5 drops from a unique boss, and you then get 3 or 4 of course that is something that will not stand out for you. However, for me, who with 146% quantity I am used to seeing Piety merciless drop me 21 items going down to 5-6 items when she is close to the middle of the room or next to a pillar then I can say without ANY doubt, there is either a terrain issue (or just a case of how the engine generates the room or how it reacts when there is no room to actually position the drops).

Hope this makes sense and apologies for the wall of text :)


EDIT: Also, I need to repeat this. Summoners, are majorly impacted if not totally screwed by this bug. Since zombies/skeletons/spectres/totems actually occupy space, they do in fact lead to loot loss on specific scenarios.

I have removed all my summoner bubbles and I have seen this occurring less now (but still occurring). I loved to play a summoner but now I just cant because it means I am actually losing a lot of loot. And if its the random rare or unique here and there I really dont mind. But what if one of the items I end up losing is a 77 map? Then seriously, I'd rather just not play this character until its fixed :)

Rare monster dropped no items at all on 42% quantity map.
One more time.
Really tired of this.

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silverthorne a écrit :

Rare monster dropped no items at all on 42% quantity map.
One more time.
Really tired of this.

I do feel your pain man, that is why I went through the whole process to prove theres something wrong. And this is also why I stopped playing on this toon and rolled a shadow ranger. But this is not just related to summoners. My ranger is using a skeleton totem and earlier I had my first no drops rare.

I mean, dont get me wrong, I appreciate the game and the efforts from the dev team, especially for a f2p game in an open beta. But the whole silence in the matter to me points to two directions. Either lack of time/will to look into this, or what is far worse, this being a game engine issue which will need shitloads of time to be resolved. Both of which scenarios are equally scary.

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Boned a écrit :

I do feel your pain man, that is why I went through the whole process to prove theres something wrong. And this is also why I stopped playing on this toon and rolled a shadow ranger. But this is not just related to summoners. My ranger is using a skeleton totem and earlier I had my first no drops rare.

Seems like i should drop my summoner for a while and back to my FP witch... Don't like this option, because I really like summoner gameplay despite the horrible AI of minions. But now doing end-game content with summoner toon looking pointless - because of lack of loot, which is not so unusual.

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But the whole silence in the matter to me points to two directions. Either lack of time/will to look into this, or what is far worse, this being a game engine issue which will need shitloads of time to be resolved. Both of which scenarios are equally scary.

There is the 3rd scenario: they are working hard on this problem and maybe in 0.10.7 this shit will be fixed! Trying to be more optimistic. But why silence?..

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Boned a écrit :

And I know for a fact that on maps with dual unique bosses, if they are killed by the same person they drop the same exact amount of loot.

Not sure if I understand what you are saying here, exactly.

But, I'll just add..

I play solo almost exclusively and I'd say 90% of my Twin boss maps have 1 of the bosses dropping far, far less than the other.

I can understand that a possible system where x mob has y number of base loot slots (that are then added to by IIQ) and some of the base slots have a chance at actually dropping (Diablo loot tables) while others are 100% drop. But I do think that Uniques only dropping 3 to 0 items and rares dropping nothing is probably not WAI.

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silverthorne a écrit :

There is the 3rd scenario: they are working hard on this problem and maybe in 0.10.7 this shit will be fixed! Trying to be more optimistic. But why silence?..

Well I dont think I sounded pessimistic really. Just hoping to see this fixed so I can go back on my summoner :) The only reason I didnt mention this scenario is exactly 'the silence' part. Think of desync and several other issues. The dev team is working on them but due to them issues being difficult or whatever, GGG informed players that it will happen but not straight away due to its difficulty. I would be happy with a response like that tbh.

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TheAnuhart a écrit :

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Boned a écrit :

And I know for a fact that on maps with dual unique bosses, if they are killed by the same person they drop the same exact amount of loot.

Not sure if I understand what you are saying here, exactly.

But, I'll just add..

I play solo almost exclusively and I'd say 90% of my Twin boss maps have 1 of the bosses dropping far, far less than the other.

I can understand that a possible system where x mob has y number of base loot slots (that are then added to by IIQ) and some of the base slots have a chance at actually dropping (Diablo loot tables) while others are 100% drop. But I do think that Uniques only dropping 3 to 0 items and rares dropping nothing is probably not WAI.

I think I was too hastey with what I typed there and since I dont generally edit my posts, in order to keep the continuity, I will clarify here. I did not refer to twinned maps, I was referring to Arcade and Promenade. On those maps each of the dual bosses (at least from what I have observed) always drop the exact same number of loot (+/- 1 again due to non 50% multiplicative IIQ). When on such a map u see one boss drop you say 10 items and the other one drops 2 (or no) items then yeah, there is something wrong there. And I actually did a test on this that I was too pissed off to take a screenshot of at the time. When I get into the mentality of wasting 2 arcade maps I will post the screenshots here.

As for the possibility of some unique bosses having varying number of drops, well I have not really seen that anywhere in game at the moment. Let me give you an example. I did 10 piety merci kills with the exact same quantity and rarity. I was getting 21 items (combination or rares/magic/uniques/currency). Now in some cases it was 22. I assume that is where the non exact 50% multiplicative IIQ comes into play. (As in with say 167% IIQ you will occassionally but not always get an extra drop than you would get with 150% IIQ). But in general it seems to me that the base amount of drops from unique bosses is predefined.

i have this issue of no drops at all when i throw a fire trap at a boss and the burning ground kills him a long time after (around 4seconds with burning ground)
it drops no loot at all (experienced that around 10 times or more already, in rares and uniques and probly a thousand times on blues but not noticeble because they come in packs)

We probly have a space related issue but we also have some problems regarding some skills

Today i managed to reproduce this bug in wharf map..i Was in a pretty small corner and a snake rare traped me at that corner.
My totems killed it and it was a pretty small corner at wharf and i got no drops at all
How can i help on this since a screenshot doesnt help that much since there is notthing on the ground


On the fire trap case my problem related here and in another threads is not about less loot or the iiq gem not affecting its drop. The problem is about no loot at all while killing the boss with burning ground ( happened three times in a unique boss so far and a lot mroe in rares )

Ty for the good work