SRS gem choices - Fire Pen VS Added Fire
" Not necessarily. Against resistant enemies, it can "essentially" double your damage, if not more. 30% or so penetration while you normally only deal about 25%. Against unresistant enemies, it still acts as a more modifier to your damage, and it stacks up with other forms of reduced resistant. Penetration gems are must-haves if you're using elemental damage, unless you are using more than one kind. |
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" Pen is one of the best dps supports for ele damage but, Lud is right. It's effectiveness diminishes as mob resistances is lowered. With 0% res and 30% pen you are getting a 30% damage bonus. With -50% res and 30% pen you are getting a 20% damage bonus. With SRS being split and not thinking to deeply into the calculation, you can halve these numbers. |
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" I run srs in a 4L with echo-multi-phys. IDK if I would run splash if I were running a 5L. Their damage/clear speed is ridiculous as is and the oooonly time I am dieing for splash is p-link or damage immune aura. Would probably run with added fire 5th with a splash on swap (best of both worlds). I have a funky setup with srs in +2 helm because the builds purpose was to run the 18% all unique staff. 6th is tough, because there are plenty of great supports. Pen, faster casting, minion speed, minion damage all have a decent affect on your clear speed. I am probably forgetting some great supports as well. Friggin minions, more links, more gem slots! Dernière édition par BackwoodsS#0171, le 21 mars 2015 à 13:53:32
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" I don't quite understand the bold part. With -50% res (from EE) and 30% pen, that would presumably lead to -80% res right? How is that any less of a damage bonus than the other case in which you had 0% res and 30% pen? For POE Devs: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ea6UuRTjkKs
Died like this in HC before: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nVsgFUiD-Y8 u_u |
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alright guys, time for some numbers and stuff
lets assume typical setup with lvl 20 Hatred aura: without added fire: damage ratio 37% physical 37% fire 26% cold ^ this was one of my points -> would you invest in support gem that affects only 37% of damage? now to the second point: - penetration (lvl 20) pure effectivness relative to enemy resist 75% resist: 140% more dmg 50% resist: 70% more dmg 0% resist: 35% more dmg -50% resist: 25% more dmg as you can see, "the less resist enemy has the less effective penetration gem is". And because hes using EE, he will be in enemy low res scenerio most of the time heres the graph that shows SRS damage multiplier relative to enemies resist. I neglected Hatred aura because of unknown monster cold resist (that can differ from fire resist).
GRAPH
 conclusion: fire pen is better in this scenario as long as enemies have more than 55% fire resist. Which is unlikely with EE (+ possible ele weakness curse) IGN: Eric_Lindros CET: Timezone Dernière édition par Ludvator#6587, le 22 mars 2015 à 05:11:17
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" Thanks for going through the explanation, its starting to make more sense now. Couple questions: 1) Does the lessened effectiveness of a penetration gem at lower and lower resists apply when compared to any other gems which would affect dps as well, or is it specifically for this circumstance of Fire Pen versus Added Fire? I want to make certain if it is a generalization when understanding the full impact a penetration gem might have versus, say Faster Casting or Added Chaos gems in the same situation. 2) Did you factor in the 70% damage effectiveness of the SRS gem into your calculation? I want to assume that this damage effectiveness would affect Added Fire but not Fire Pen, but I might be misunderstanding how it works (ie that damage effectiveness only impacts linked support gems than add specific damage to the main skill, not support gems that don't fit the category of 'dealing damage'). For POE Devs: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ea6UuRTjkKs Died like this in HC before: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nVsgFUiD-Y8 u_u Dernière édition par Peripherally#5392, le 22 mars 2015 à 05:44:06
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1) its just how resists work. damage source is irrelevant
lets say you (or minion) hit an enemy for 100 fire damage: 75% resistant enemy takes 25 damage, 40% resistant enemy (35% penetration) 60 -> 140% more 0% resistant enemy takes 100 damage, -35% resistant enemy (35% penetration) 135 -> 35% more 2) added fire adds %damage based on phys damage (before conversions). I dont think is is affected by effectivnes, because base damage already is (technically) thus it would be affected twice.. effectivness affects added flat damage (Anger aura, Added chaos gem etc..) IGN: Eric_Lindros
CET: Timezone |
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That clears things up, thx.
Seems like I will keep thinking of ways to alter/augment traditional SRS setup, see if I can't get something effective but different/fun too. For POE Devs: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ea6UuRTjkKs Died like this in HC before: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nVsgFUiD-Y8 u_u Dernière édition par Peripherally#5392, le 23 mars 2015 à 05:25:38
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why reinvent the wheel , when the best wheel already exists?
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" For now, sure it does. But the beauty of new patches and skill gems and expansions is they always bring something different. SRS happens to be one of my favorite skills in PoE but I don't want the formula for it to become stale over time. How fun would it be to see something you like never change (or get better or varied)? For POE Devs: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ea6UuRTjkKs
Died like this in HC before: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nVsgFUiD-Y8 u_u |
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