The leagues we have I. The game goes against what the game should be

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LW187#4876 a écrit :

I would personally agree with you and I dont think it works longterm but I would not put it past mankind that this clientel at least exists.

The clientele definitely exists, but as with anything, you need a good product and the right audience for that product.

Right now, PoE2 has at least half the wrong audience that want something it wasn't supposed to be. It's also a very unfinished product with possibly half or more of it's game content being placeholders or not implemented yet, not to mention the amount of balance and testing still needed.

Honestly, it's kind of doing okay considering the circumstances, but it's far from where it needs to be for any sort of proper release.

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ShaDarkLord#6528 a écrit :

...or start from scratch: rework every core mechanic, give all monsters actual AI and trim down those walking simulators you call maps.

Like I said in the post you quoted, it's a matter of tailoring the mechanics to the new gameplay style. I wouldn't say start from scratch, but easing up on the league/endgame stuff that require speed, for example.

I think the overall campaign progress already feels better with the recent patches. Room for improvement, yes, but it's a step in the right direction... It just needs a few more steps...

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Glowie_Zigger#5018 a écrit :

Thats a fair point. I think it would also be fair to say however that most players' behavior suggests that they want to play quickly. All you have to do is look at the % of people choosing each class and ascendancy and it's pretty clear that slow methodical gameplay is not highly desired. The game that they ported all of this content from was successful, while this one is failing. Seems the path forward is quite obvious

It's not that ppl don't want an engaging combat, is just that the game punishes you for doing that rn, and rewards you for going fast

Delirium = be fast
Breach = be fast
Azmerian wisps = be fast
Monsters in general = too deadly, kill them asap so you don't give them enough room to use a bs skill
Campaign = too long, kill things asap so you can progress faster and actually build your character in the way you want to play

I really hope GGG sees this post.

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Glowie_Zigger#5018 a écrit :

I agree. I just don't think many of them are die-hards that GGG can count on keeping around for years to come. It's pure speculation but that type of gameplay isn't as addictive as seeing 40,000 items drop on the ground with a bunch of loot beams. Like they really need to come to grips with reality and see that they have a bunch of addicts begging for their next hit and they're basically jabbing them with Naloxone and sending them to the methodone clinic

Maybe they are actually saving lives here : )

Honestly, the first sound of a divine drop hit me hard. It was like a hit of amphetamines — I was grinding through the night just to hear that sweet ding again. I was running a Lightning Warp build, zipping across the map like a maniac, chasing that serotonin rush.

Then I discovered the KY comet build. And after that — CWDT. Eventually, I ended up fusing the KY and CWDT builds into some glorious mess of destruction. And it was fun. I didn’t even see the monsters — just hundreds of comets raining down, deleting the screen.

That’s when I finally understood the high PoE demons.


I’m not against slow-paced gameplay — I’ve completed pretty much every Souls-like out there (Dark Souls 1, 2, 3, Elden Ring, Nioh, Sekiro, Lords of the Fallen, Lies of Pi and etc). I’m a huge fan of high-risk, high-reward systems — that’s what makes Souls games exciting. Now POE 2 is high and litteraly 0 reward.

let’s be real: all Souls games are story-driven games. I only know a couple of people who’ve played 1000+ hours into each one. Personally, I could manage 2–3 playthroughs of a few, and that was enough. Once you’ve memorized every boss mechanic down to the last animation frame, it just stops being interesting.

PoE, on the other hand, is about repetitive monster killing — and I mean that in a good way. That repetition is the core of what makes people play thousands of hours. Without that addictive loop, without the dopamine drip of loot explosions, why would anyone keep playing? Killing a boss just for the sake of killing a boss? What’s the point?

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Vyend#2601 a écrit :

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Glowie_Zigger#5018 a écrit :

Thats a fair point. I think it would also be fair to say however that most players' behavior suggests that they want to play quickly. All you have to do is look at the % of people choosing each class and ascendancy and it's pretty clear that slow methodical gameplay is not highly desired. The game that they ported all of this content from was successful, while this one is failing. Seems the path forward is quite obvious

It's not that ppl don't want an engaging combat, is just that the game punishes you for doing that rn, and rewards you for going fast

Delirium = be fast
Breach = be fast
Azmerian wisps = be fast
Monsters in general = too deadly, kill them asap so you don't give them enough room to use a bs skill
Campaign = too long, kill things asap so you can progress faster and actually build your character in the way you want to play

I think the vast majority of people do not want to heavily interact with the mobs the way GGG tells them they want to. A little bit here and there is fine, but it is exhausting after a while. What is the alternative to this anyway, is it going to reward you for playing slow? Sounds boring as shit. The whole point of a game like this is to make a character as strong and as fast as possible to negate as many mechanics as possible and maximize your loot. Deviating from that design space is a pretty risky decision

The numbers obviously support this being true. I think the numbers are also incorrect. For example, it may show that x% have chosen the lich ascendancy, but does it correctly show how many of these people made it to level 90, realized that their character is painfully slow and boring in endgame, then swapped to an amazon and used the same busted build as everyone else? The game always will degenerate to this when such an option exists

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Stryfer#0953 a écrit :

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ShaDarkLord#6528 a écrit :

...or start from scratch: rework every core mechanic, give all monsters actual AI and trim down those walking simulators you call maps.

Like I said in the post you quoted, it's a matter of tailoring the mechanics to the new gameplay style. I wouldn't say start from scratch, but easing up on the league/endgame stuff that require speed, for example.

I think the overall campaign progress already feels better with the recent patches. Room for improvement, yes, but it's a step in the right direction... It just needs a few more steps...

I've dropped my second atempt after nerf mobs patch. I've stopped at 3act with only 2 deaths. First when i tried to kill 2nd act boss. I managed to kill him only after 2nd attempt switching to spear from xbow. It tooks like 15minutes mindless dodging and massaging him by 100 dmg. And then on 1st boss on 3rd act. Then i asked to help my mate with him...which is 93 lvl on bow with good gear. He managed to kill him for 15 seconds. Come on. Decent geared deadeye killed non mandatory boss from start of 3rd only within 15 seconds when in 0.1 i would killed him like within 1-2 seconds. Then i dropped this sluggish crap.

i can't hear this "slow and meaningful" anymore. these two things have nothing in common. combat hasnt to be slow to be interesting, it hasnt to be slow to be more challenging or "meaningful". most times its more challenging if things happen faster and i dont have 15 seconds to react. so in the end slow is nothing else but fckn slow. doing things slow makes them boring, nothing else.

The problem isn't the slow combat or gameplay, see how many people love the campaign when it was new.
The issue is the reward structure being CBT. It's worse than faster arpg on larger maps with slower and weaker characters.
The rewards should be rewarding (resources to craft, fuck craft materials as trade currency) for the time spent and people would be happy. The real issue is that there is no progression and you have to play 12hours a day to get small things that most players never get to see. You should get 1 divine per 1-2maps since it is not that good for crafting and like 5-10ex per map so people can "slam currency to craft" all day... and some other buffs to essences etc.

GGG has to touch the loot basically.

My problem is that even having 12 hrs to kill playing POE2 i can't convince myself to want to. It's already way less fun in 0.2 than it was in 0.1.