Where POE2 went wrong and why the latest announcement on POE1 wont fix it.

What you all know as POE2 was initially announced as an expansion and update to POE1. It was sometime last year that they actually made the catastrophic mistake of making it a new game. Instead of announcing an expansion, a campaign revamp, a mechanics simplification and revamp they decided to make it a new game for one reason.

They wanted to get revenue from what they call "casual players". That's it. There is no other reason. They could have been spending time updating the old campaign with cinematics or just replacing it and putting in the new campaign with the old game. They could have done a lot of things but it became clear to them that they could make money from the ADHD drive by players. So for a sequel we get a completely different game that is very incomplete and messed up. The ADHD crowd will be off playing something else in a couple of weeks, and indeed the drop off of 80% of POE2 players since EA launch bears this out.

The new announcement is expected, they are frantically throwing something together after seeing POE1 servers dive to a low player count they have never seen before. Who could have guessed telling a loyal fanbase for 10 years "Go pound sand, we want a different casual customer that isn't you" would cause animosity? So there will be all these new ascendancies. This is what you should have been working on for POE2. There will be all these new mechanics, all these new experimental features. So in addition to telling them to pound sand we will be acutely aware of the fact that POE1 is being reverted to a beta-ish "well we don't know if it will even work" quality. On top of it, we know if there is something we like in there it wont matter because POE2 is the new baby and GGG doesn't care about POE1.

GGG will regret flipping the middle finger to its loyal fanbase for the drive by casual fanbase. When those fans go away and they cant compete with BLizzard's marketing budget they will get it. Its gonna take 6 months but they will get it.

Then ... maybe ... POE2 will be renamed to something else and they will try to do what they intended originally. Will it be too late? No one knows. Games rarely come back from such debacles.

As for me? I am not playing a GGG product until the sequel to POE1 is really a sequel to POE1 and that, I am aware, may be "never." That's fine, there are lots of other companies that want my money.

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What you all know as POE2 was initially announced as an expansion and update to POE1. It was sometime last year that they actually made the catastrophic mistake of making it a new game. Instead of announcing an expansion, a campaign revamp, a mechanics simplification and revamp they decided to make it a new game for one reason.

That's not true. GGG announced that PoE2 will be a separate game in summer 2023.

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They wanted to get revenue from what they call "casual players". That's it. There is no other reason. They could have been spending time updating the old campaign with cinematics or just replacing it and putting in the new campaign with the old game. They could have done a lot of things but it became clear to them that they could make money from the ADHD drive by players. So for a sequel we get a completely different game that is very incomplete and messed up. The ADHD crowd will be off playing something else in a couple of weeks, and indeed the drop off of 80% of POE2 players since EA launch bears this out.

Everything you said there are baseless assumptions. They clearly explained why they split PoE1 and PoE2, like it or not.

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The new announcement is expected, they are frantically throwing something together after seeing POE1 servers dive to a low player count they have never seen before. Who could have guessed telling a loyal fanbase for 10 years "Go pound sand, we want a different casual customer that isn't you" would cause animosity? So there will be all these new ascendancies. This is what you should have been working on for POE2. There will be all these new mechanics, all these new experimental features. So in addition to telling them to pound sand we will be acutely aware of the fact that POE1 is being reverted to a beta-ish "well we don't know if it will even work" quality. On top of it, we know if there is something we like in there it wont matter because POE2 is the new baby and GGG doesn't care about POE1.

That's a lie. The PoE1 population was nothing unusual or unexpected for that time into the league. Stop making things up. They released PoE2 EA because they wanted to release PoE2 EA, and they did it even later because they had to delay it. That had nothing to do with some tinfoil player count stuff you've said.

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GGG will regret flipping the middle finger to its loyal fanbase for the drive by casual fanbase. When those fans go away and they cant compete with BLizzard's marketing budget they will get it. Its gonna take 6 months but they will get it.

Then ... maybe ... POE2 will be renamed to something else and they will try to do what they intended originally. Will it be too late? No one knows. Games rarely come back from such debacles.

As for me? I am not playing a GGG product until the sequel to POE1 is really a sequel to POE1 and that, I am aware, may be "never." That's fine, there are lots of other companies that want my money.

Sure, see you next league.

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Kraythax#2592 a écrit :

[...] they decided to make it a new game for one reason.

They wanted to get revenue from what they call "casual players". That's it. There is no other reason. They could have been spending time updating the old campaign with cinematics or just replacing it and putting in the new campaign with the old game. They could have done a lot of things but it became clear to them that they could make money from the ADHD drive by players.

I'm sure GGG has a long-term vision.
Hence the release of a second game rather than a “big update”.

They know very well that they won't have a perennial business with a single big hit like an EA release (if they don't invest in the game, it's just one big cash inflow followed by an abysmal trough, which isn't viable for a company that claims to be expanding).

"

Kraythax#2592 a écrit :

So for a sequel we get a completely different game that is very incomplete and messed up. The ADHD crowd will be off playing something else in a couple of weeks, and indeed the drop off of 80% of POE2 players since EA launch bears this out.

It's normal for the game to be different. We're talking about a new game, not PoE 1.5.

The drop in player numbers can also be explained by the fact that PoE has always been driven by the release of new leagues.
Each of them brings a peak in the number of players, and then the number gradually decreases over the weeks.
It's the game's natural cycle.

Also “game that is very incomplete”: we're talking about an EA, so yes, it's obvious that the game is incomplete.
The campaign isn't over yet, and changes are obviously still to come.

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Kraythax#2592 a écrit :

The new announcement is expected, they are frantically throwing something together after seeing POE1 servers dive to a low player count they have never seen before.

No kidding, a league that lasted more than 8 months (9 months now?) lost most of its players?
But what a surprise (TW: sarcasm)

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Kraythax#2592 a écrit :

Who could have guessed telling a loyal fanbase for 10 years "Go pound sand, we want a different casual customer that isn't you" would cause animosity? So there will be all these new ascendancies. This is what you should have been working on for POE2. There will be all these new mechanics, all these new experimental features. So in addition to telling them to pound sand we will be acutely aware of the fact that POE1 is being reverted to a beta-ish "well we don't know if it will even work" quality. On top of it, we know if there is something we like in there it wont matter because POE2 is the new baby and GGG doesn't care about POE1.

GIVE THEM TIME.

You can't accuse a company that has just embarked on a titanic project and whose teams are overwhelmed (which is publicly admitted by their own admission) of continuing to offer regular, high-quality content.

GIVE IT TIME.

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Kraythax#2592 a écrit :

GGG will regret flipping the middle finger to its loyal fanbase for the drive by casual fanbase. When those fans go away and they cant compete with BLizzard's marketing budget they will get it. Its gonna take 6 months but they will get it.

Then ... maybe ... POE2 will be renamed to something else and they will try to do what they intended originally. Will it be too late? No one knows. Games rarely come back from such debacles.

As for me? I am not playing a GGG product until the sequel to POE1 is really a sequel to POE1 and that, I am aware, may be "never." That's fine, there are lots of other companies that want my money.

Lots of assumptions.

As you say, time will tell, but I personally still have faith in GGG.

We can't expect a 2-month EA to be perfect and, at the same time, the “main” game to be continually updated. The development time was doubled, and they have publicly admitted that they were overwhelmed.

I'm repeating myself: give them time.

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Kraythax#2592 a écrit :

Instead of announcing an expansion, a campaign revamp, a mechanics simplification and revamp they decided to make it a new game for one reason.

They wanted to get revenue from what they call "casual players". That's it. There is no other reason.

How about making the game they can enjoy? I think this reason alone is enough. Jonathan stated that he can't enjoy playing PoE 1 anymore. Campaign revamp wouldn't change that.

I have no idea why people often accuse GGG in greedy, it's one of the least greedy companies I can think of.

They deliberately handcuffed the player base with this ridiculous XP Penalty to hamper progression.

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MarcoBezzecchi#3752 a écrit :

They deliberately handcuffed the player base with this ridiculous XP Penalty to hamper progression.

Yeah... 10% is sooo ridiculous, not.

Use an omen to lose 75% less exp on death or even prevent you from dying.

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MarcoBezzecchi#3752 a écrit :

They deliberately handcuffed the player base with this ridiculous XP Penalty to hamper progression.

This is different topic and there are already hundred of threads about it.

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Kaewis#5884 a écrit :

GIVE THEM TIME.

You can't accuse a company that has just embarked on a titanic project and whose teams are overwhelmed (which is publicly admitted by their own admission) of continuing to offer regular, high-quality content.

GIVE IT TIME.

They have been working on it supposedly 5 years. They have intentionally made a lot of bad decisions. I personally am playing other things and as of now I dont foresee I or my wallet comming back. Not that they care. They made a cynical decision that a bunch of casuals are more valuable. Got the message loud and clear.

So why am I here complaining? Because I am at work and cant play games and I have to get something for my Liberator of Wraeclast pack that I shouldn't have bought.

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Kraythax#2592 a écrit :

"

Kaewis#5884 a écrit :

GIVE THEM TIME.

You can't accuse a company that has just embarked on a titanic project and whose teams are overwhelmed (which is publicly admitted by their own admission) of continuing to offer regular, high-quality content.

GIVE IT TIME.

They have been working on it supposedly 5 years. They have intentionally made a lot of bad decisions. I personally am playing other things and as of now I dont foresee I or my wallet comming back. Not that they care. They made a cynical decision that a bunch of casuals are more valuable. Got the message loud and clear.

So why am I here complaining? Because I am at work and cant play games and I have to get something for my Liberator of Wraeclast pack that I shouldn't have bought.

8 months for settlers and you have 12 challenges. . .

I might take you seriously if you were 40/40 and wanted new content, but THIS??


lol.




P.S. yes I also have 12, but you dont see me complaining about no new poe league. . .

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thawn4444#3507 a écrit :

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Kraythax#2592 a écrit :

"

Kaewis#5884 a écrit :

GIVE THEM TIME.

You can't accuse a company that has just embarked on a titanic project and whose teams are overwhelmed (which is publicly admitted by their own admission) of continuing to offer regular, high-quality content.

GIVE IT TIME.

They have been working on it supposedly 5 years. They have intentionally made a lot of bad decisions. I personally am playing other things and as of now I dont foresee I or my wallet comming back. Not that they care. They made a cynical decision that a bunch of casuals are more valuable. Got the message loud and clear.

So why am I here complaining? Because I am at work and cant play games and I have to get something for my Liberator of Wraeclast pack that I shouldn't have bought.

8 months for settlers and you have 12 challenges. . .

I might take you seriously if you were 40/40 and wanted new content, but THIS??


lol.




P.S. yes I also have 12, but you dont see me complaining about no new poe league. . .

Why do people keep making this dumbass argument?

Most players don't get much more than 12 challenges in a given league, before burning out and needing new content to pique interest again. Going back to the same league to get more challenges changes little about the league, and people who want the more time consuming or difficult challenges aren't the ones that stopped playing the league in the first place.