Regarding Stygian Vise -Suggestion-

To anyone reading,

So with the release of abyss league, came many new items. One being the Stygian Vise, currently because of how strong the abyss jewels are, it made every other belt base irrelevant compared to it. Example: you can roll +50 life on a abyss jewel along with other modifiers, which puts leather belt's 40 life implict far behind. The damage rolls on abyss jewels giving crit multiplier, attack speeds, % gained as extra fire gives way more damage than a rustic sash on a phys build. Because of how powerful Stygian is currently, almost every build uses it, with the rare exception of GG corrupts such as +1 endurance charge or builds that lacks strength, in which case they opt for a heavy belt.

I personally would like to have more diversity in gear choices, and currently stygian vise are locked BIS item for almost every build. My suggestion is to indirectly nerf stygian, making the old belts more relevant again.

Here's my idea:
If a player uses a stygian vise, then they are only allowed to use abyss jewels on their passive tree, meaning they cant use rare cobalt, crimson, or viridian jewels on their tree(this needs to be balanced for unique jewels - currently no idea on how to balance that please leave feedback/suggestion in the thread)
By doing this, stygian vise will still be very powerful and relevant especially for builds that stack flat ele dmg using abyss jewels. At the same time other belt bases will be used more often as a result, since some builds scale better with % scaling over flat scaling.

the root cause are abyss jewels - these are completely stupid and values of mods (and some of the mods themselves) are beyond insane

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Abdiel_Kavash a écrit :

Stygian Vises should drop magic, always with two mods, and corrupted.

ahhh kinda like talisman :P

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WindFaLL95 a écrit :

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Abdiel_Kavash a écrit :

Stygian Vises should drop magic, always with two mods, and corrupted.

ahhh kinda like talisman :P

Too late for that. A buff to other belts' implicit - with the possible exception of crystal and vanguard ones - would help. Or a nerf to Abyss jewels, without leaving legacy ones - but that would create a lot of trouble imho...

They are flavor of the league. If they are to stay in any form, they will be rare as all fucks. And to be honest, that is a pretty nice thing to add. Another room for improvement, to roll things and so on.
Just make Abyss a map/zana/sextant/whatever mod, and make jewels/belts WAY more rare than they are now. So that, say, you find maybe one belt or jewel every 100 abysses cleared.

Imagine them being a ~2ex base item next league, where abyss jewels cost similar. Rolling a BiS jewel will not be as easy as it is now, but will give you an option to improve your belt slot once you gain large amounts of currency to burn.
Because without that, belt slot is pretty boring. :V

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Perq a écrit :

They are flavor of the league. If they are to stay in any form, they will be rare as all fucks. And to be honest, that is a pretty nice thing to add. Another room for improvement, to roll things and so on.
Just make Abyss a map/zana/sextant/whatever mod, and make jewels/belts WAY more rare than they are now. So that, say, you find maybe one belt or jewel every 100 abysses cleared.

Imagine them being a ~2ex base item next league, where abyss jewels cost similar. Rolling a BiS jewel will not be as easy as it is now, but will give you an option to improve your belt slot once you gain large amounts of currency to burn.
Because without that, belt slot is pretty boring. :V

yeah I think so perq. If abyss is a zana mod make it lvl8 and cost significant money and then make the jewels quite rare and the belts extremely rare.

The jewels are hard as hell to roll, its only cause so many are around that theres so many good ones, theyre far harder than normal jewels.


I agree with the op in terms of the belt being overpowered, we were even saying it before the league, from the moment they first showcased the belt we were saying ok, that thing is pretty busted strong. I think it was the right thing to make them so plentyful in the league so that even the little guys could get em, but long term in future leagues either dont have abyss as a mod or just make the belts really really hard to find. Perhaps they only drop in the actual depths too is an idea, that way u dont get elder ones.

The new elder belt bases with 10% life on them are sick, to not be able to get that on a stygian in a league would really shake up the considerations. Weve moved into a really cool area where the bases to roll the best possible rares are in themselves extremely rare, its not like everyones gonna have a 99 life + 10% life elder belt in a league either, as long as the rarity is correct the other belt bases have their place.

GGG beware stygian div cards, plz, dont get carried away with urselves :D


In fairness I feel like a 2h RT build gets so little from those jewels that if ur base of choice is leather then yeah, styg is straight up better. If its rustic? I dunno that u can beat a rustic on all those builds for damage without getting into 'on kill' bullshit that drops off on a lot of important boss moments etc. I will still use a rustic on a couple of builds tbh.

1h crit tho? Man, the styg is insane, too insane to be anything other than extremely rare, like getting a high ilvl elder steel ring or whatever. But good that such things exist I think cause the game was getting so saturated, no chase items does not make for a good loot hunt game, thats a really bad situation to be in.

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Snorkle_uk a écrit :

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In fairness I feel like a 2h RT build gets so little from those jewels that if ur base of choice is leather then yeah, styg is straight up better. If its rustic? I dunno that u can beat a rustic on all those builds for damage without getting into 'on kill' bullshit that drops off on a lot of important boss moments etc. I will still use a rustic on a couple of builds tbh.

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Well from my little experience (lv 89 RT Sunder using 2H Axe) a jewel with 2 damage mods of the right type - nothing insane - beats a 24% rustic, dps wise, esp when your char is high lvl. And on top of those mods jewels can have flat life and other things u need (more dps, atk spd, stats, res, etc.).

I feel GGG have already nerfed the droprate of stygian belts ( imho, could be also my RNG, and will probably make them a lot rarer and gated behind Zana once the league is over. But that won't change the fact that they are - together with good abyss jewels - BiS for most builds.

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Snorkle_uk a écrit :

Perhaps they only drop in the actual depths too is an idea, that way u dont get elder ones.

Thhhaaaat is actually great idea. More decision making = more time tinkering = more PoE fun.

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Wazz72 a écrit :

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Snorkle_uk a écrit :

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In fairness I feel like a 2h RT build gets so little from those jewels that if ur base of choice is leather then yeah, styg is straight up better. If its rustic? I dunno that u can beat a rustic on all those builds for damage without getting into 'on kill' bullshit that drops off on a lot of important boss moments etc. I will still use a rustic on a couple of builds tbh.

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Well from my little experience (lv 89 RT Sunder using 2H Axe) a jewel with 2 damage mods of the right type - nothing insane - beats a 24% rustic, dps wise, esp when your char is high lvl. And on top of those mods jewels can have flat life and other things u need (more dps, atk spd, stats, res, etc.).

I feel GGG have already nerfed the droprate of stygian belts ( imho, could be also my RNG, and will probably make them a lot rarer and gated behind Zana once the league is over. But that won't change the fact that they are - together with good abyss jewels - BiS for most builds.

if ur talking about adding flat damage to the axe then how that is weighed against the % from a rustic is down to how brutal ur axe is and how much flat added phys ur already pumping into it and how much % increased u already have. when ur looking at 560+ top end phys on ur axe with only 1.35 aps and ur adding another 15 or something its not rly doing a great deal, unless u went absolutely beserk on % increase from the tree.

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Perq a écrit :

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Snorkle_uk a écrit :

Perhaps they only drop in the actual depths too is an idea, that way u dont get elder ones.

Thhhaaaat is actually great idea. More decision making = more time tinkering = more PoE fun.

I got a bunch of elder bases to take back to standard, theyre on a collision vector with a pile of chaos Im saving up to craft them. I actually want a rustic for my earthquaker, i got some ilvl84 rustic elders waiting in league but I had a little spam on a ilvl75 elder rustic on standard, got semi lucky and hit these prefixes quite quickly




its not what i want, I want 99 + 10% + 400 armour, but it was good enough for now until the leagues merge. The elder belts are really cool, if u cant get a stygian elder in a league then its definitely not the clear cut best base because 10% life is gonna blitz 50 flat, or if u go leather then its 10% life vs maybe 12 crit multi and 5% attack speed which is kind of a balanced trade in terms of small node values on the tree. You the sort of guy who always wants more life or u the sort of guy whos gonna skip some life nodes anyway and try to harvest as much multi as u can?



the premise is right tho, when this league merges with standard I think a good 80% of my long term builds will be switching to stygians. Not helped by the fact I have elder stygian bases.