Trade Manifesto

You need to do something with console trade. Trade market may sound good to some PC players who haven't seen it, but it's not. While it's OK if you need to find unique, it's almost impossible to find the right rares.

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samTallonRUS a écrit :

You need to do something with console trade. Trade market may sound good to some PC players who haven't seen it, but it's not. While it's OK if you need to find unique, it's almost impossible to find the right rares.

Anyone who has a few (functioning, very important part) brain cells can see that. Neither the PC nor the Console version are in any way acceptable by today's standards, not even remotely.

While right now it's 'almost' impossible to find the right rare, imagine how it will be if the player-base doubles... or triples. A vastly increased amount of offers you've to search through, a larger variety of items, and the one you are searching? An hour into the search, good luck!

Another point is that you can't discern the actual price of an item, how many people have similar ones? Is it worth 1 ex? 10c? A mirror? Who knows.

As for the PC version, try it out and you'll see the obvious issues. I spent 6 hours this league simply to buy maps... 6 hours, for roughly 100 maps overall. That's a disaster which no game in any closely related genre has seen yet! I want to PLAY the game, not sit back trying desperately to buy the things which I need for my progression.

Also price-fixers are a massive issue. This was the case with the 'Elder Lair map' early in the league, a single person listed over 150 of those as the cheapest price, never answering though. On the other hand we had 0 (!) other people even possessing the map, he bought them all to have a monopoly on the market.

Don't get me wrong though, the BASE system of both are good, the funcionality of the PC version is vastly superior to the Console one. While the implementation of the Console one is vastly superior to the PC.
Yes, the Manifesto states what GGG thought about it... though GGG thought wrong regarding... well... every single point there, a counter-argument pointing the entire different direction is available, and we won't see which way it goes unless they TEST it out LIVE and for a decent time... which they don't even seem bothered to do.

I truly understand the decisions behind such Trade system as it is in Path of Exile, beeing old D2 player who is used to Trade Forums back then. This Form of Trade is a great Solution for Items that grant your Character any sort of Progression. BUT.

This game has other Things that has to be traded, that give no direct Progression at all, first of all Currency, and Maps.

Every Player has to experience a negative example of flooded stock market economics with currency values changing over days, and even hours in the start of the League. Putting a lot of Pressure to Trade quick, as your currency might Loose value, or to hold on currency, because it will grow. This is a great platform for any kind of bad market behaviors such as speculation, creation of illusive market trends by any type of manipulation, such as fake news on reddit, creating fake trade postings, buying complete supply and then resale it much higher price.

All this, makes players hold on to their currency and not use it in any way. Every Body is just stockpiling any kind of Orb's not making any progress through finds they did.

Trying to buy or sell some currency is absolute Pain and feels way more like some Broker game and not ARPG. Either you have to complete 100's of Trades and exchange orb by orb, or you have to pay absolute Premium for Bulk, just to minimize your trade Time.


Those mechanisms also impact Item Trading, but due to no defined "Value" of Items, this is a Part of the Item Trade nature. And should be kept as it is.

But this is not needed to be a Part of Currency trades and here is my suggestion:

1: Trivialize Currency Trading to some degree as you did it for the lower Orbs.
2: Bring some consistency in your Pattern how currency are valued in form of each other.
3. Delete lower currency from Drop Tables on higher area levels nobody pick's it up anyway.
4. Make a find of a currency a relevant thing, that brings joy. Only Exalted Drop or Mirror Drop is a heymaker now. Nobody is doped about a Chaos Drop.

How to do this:

1. Make same Ratio's of Currency Trade for all Currency in both ways (Only standard Currency, not a Leauge specific currency).

Not only 3 Armourer's Scrap -> 1 Blacksmith's Whetstone
But also 1 Blacksmith's Whetstones -> 3 Armourer's Scrap

2. Instead of dropping somewhat about 200 Wisdoms Scrolls, 80 Portal Scrolls, 50 Orb's or Transmutation, 30 Orbs of Augentation, 10 Orbs of Alteration, 4 Alchemy Orbs, and 1 Chaos Orb on a average T15 Map, make only higher currency drop, getting rid of all this small currency and drop one or two additional chaos drops, that can be exchanged down for smaller currency. No Player in the world wants to loots 500 small things from a 3 minit Map run. It will solve a stash Problem a little bit too.

3. Install New NPC who sell all the currency types to those rates back and forth.

Especcialy SSF Leauge's would have a great Joy on this system, as they can now upgrade chaos to an exalt for using a crafting bench, or break down found exalt to chaos craft multiple items for multiple slots.

As it is right now, those currency drop's are not really helpful for SSF Players, and lower Currency is actually more needed for some crafting process as higher currency. Forcing a SSF Player to Farm 1500 alterations buy gathering junk and selling it to vendor for hours just to create a solid magic base is bad design, especially if this player found a couple of exalts that he cannot make any use of.

4. For Maps you already have a solution to some Part, Zana selling maps. Just make her sell way more maps, and different maps, making players able to purchase missing Atlas Progression ingame even for higher Price and not in the Trade Site.

Best Regards

I just want to be able to buy a map without whispering 50 people. I burn out every league due to this, and never get to complete my atlas.

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enol13 a écrit :

I just want to be able to buy a map without whispering 50 people. I burn out every league due to this, and never get to complete my atlas.

+1

ggg can we get auction house please??

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enol13 a écrit :

I just want to be able to buy a map without whispering 50 people. I burn out every league due to this, and never get to complete my atlas.

Use poe.ninja (like poe.trade, only better) and bulk buy maps. Problem solved.

If chaos recipe started from 76+ item level to 80 item level it would fix alot problem with ex:c rate and help fight with bots

Also ggg need more ban to all bots and trade bots too, special to trade bots and all kind bots as they ruin economy

Thanks GGG, i'd hate an Auction House system, people already complain about bots and currency sellers, NOW imagine bots insta buying worth itens that are cheap, also everyone instant buying all the gear they need in less than a minute.
It would ruin Path of Exile, would be the start of it's downfall.

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Cyzax a écrit :

Use poe.ninja (like poe.trade, only better) and bulk buy maps. Problem solved.

Not a solution early in a league. Patchwork simply, so it's not relevant.

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TreeOfDead a écrit :

If chaos recipe started from 76+ item level to 80 item level it would fix alot problem with ex:c rate and help fight with bots

Also ggg need more ban to all bots and trade bots too, special to trade bots and all kind bots as they ruin economy

Chaos-recipe isn't done by any efficient player outside of SSF, bots focus on trading only, not farming usually. Far easier to program a bot standing around and interacting with players rather then with content.

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bekflip1 a écrit :

Thanks GGG, i'd hate an Auction House system, people already complain about bots and currency sellers, NOW imagine bots insta buying worth itens that are cheap, also everyone instant buying all the gear they need in less than a minute.
It would ruin Path of Exile, would be the start of it's downfall.

Don't under-price items then. Bot's aren't re-sellers, they use the margin of profit commonly created by the lack of an AH. This margin would be smaller with a proper system in place.
People already insta-buy all the GEAR they need, the choke-point is currency not availability there.
Where an AH shines is to alleviate the issue with price-fixing, which is a major one at the moment, as well as controlling the market in general. A bot is far quicker in interacting with players compared to player-player interaction. This would also be solved with any common trading system.

No it wouldn't, you need to think a bit further then 1 step with economy.

I'm playing this game since open beta in 2012.

This manifesto is a huge mistake now. This game need a Trade House for maps and currencies. We don't need an auction house, just a trade interface in which we could buyout maps and currencies.