duelist survival

Hey.

So i've been through first difficulty and it was fun.
I play as a dual wield duelist with passives to +dmg, +dual wield etc. I use cleave, flicker strike (i still prefer dual strike), dual strike, blood rage, elemental support gems.

I think of going dual wield AoF since my dmg on cruel isn;t that good right now and from what i've read AOF is the best dmg passive u can get coupled with gems. Anyone tried dual wield with that?

Also my main question is about survival. Right now i have around 37% dmg reduction and about 20% evasion and when i get hit from mobs in act1 especialy rare one it feels like TRUCK. My half hp goes down. (i have about 90str 100dex)

So is it normal? Should i be really hit like that? I know it's not marauder class and it's more squishy but still. I feel like i am so weak ;o

Dernière édition par Krayt, le 2 févr. 2012 08:59:23
Dernier bump le 24 oct. 2017 13:06:35
Considering the problems your facing already.. an AoF dual wielding Deulist is out of the question for you. AoF's are geared for maximizing DPS at the expense of Defense. You're having issues with Defense already in Cruel so a glass cannon build probably wouldn't suit you. There is no easy way to make a balanced AoF as you're generally going to have to make big sacrifices. Is it possible? Sure, but it's not very practical.

As for armor. Don't use Str/Dex items, you're spreading your defense too thin that way and gimping yourself. You should commit fully to either all Str(armor) or all Dex(evasion). If you decide to go the evasion route, it's often a good idea to take Iron Refelxes too.

Until you get more experienced and know exactly what mods you want.. just look for x% Increase Defense mods. The higher the number the better. Always keep your armor up to date. If you're level 30 don't run around with level 16 armor unless you really can't find anything better.

The best AoF Dual wield Deulist that I can think of at the moment is a Dual 1h Mace build. http://poezone.ru/skilltree/#5M. Keep in mind this focuses primarily on DPS and Health. You'll notice that I took Resolute Technique. In my opinion it's pretty much mandatory because one of the drawbacks in pursuing AoF is the lack of accuracy. With this build, base accuracy would be around 65%. Unless you like missing 1 out of every 3 attacks.. Resolute Technique is the way to go.
Dernière édition par FaceLicker, le 2 févr. 2012 13:31:38
thx for the tipis.

I think i am gonna wait for .96 to see if dual wield will be better than it is right now. 2handers are the way to go right now unfortunately and are better. Hopefully it will change a little.
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Krayt a écrit :
2handers are the way to go right now unfortunately and are better.
This is simply not true. I, as well as many others, have no problems dual wielding. In fact, the winner of the most recent ladder was a dual wield Deulist. Dual wielding can be exceptionally powerful if you build properly. Someone else can just as easily say that dual wielding is the way to go because they seem to be struggling with 2h.
what about 2 handers having more linked sockets than 1 handers? That makes stacking support gems better. Also in duail wield build you usually go str/dex build which makes you more vulnerable to attacks than with str build. (less dmg reduciton less life) Also with 2h build u usually go AoF which is kinda OP right now.

Just pointing out my thoughts since i talked with some chaos players and i only myself experienced cruelty difficulty. I would be glad if i were wrong. Again correct me if i am wrong but isn't flicker build most effective right now while plaing duelist?
Dernière édition par Krayt, le 3 févr. 2012 05:40:54
I really don't understand how you're in the position, someone who claims to only have made it to Cruel, to make generalized assumptions on what players 'usually' do.

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Krayt a écrit :
what about 2 handers having more linked sockets than 1 handers? That makes stacking support gems better
Yes, this is true, 2handers have the potential to have 6 linked sockets whereas 1handers will give you 2 sets of 3 linked sockets. It's definitely a benefit, but in no way game changing. You'll spend a long time looking for that 6 linked, not to mention trying to get the right color combo, but you're guaranteed to find 3 linked 1handers.
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Krayt a écrit :
Also in duail wield build you usually go str/dex build which makes you more vulnerable to attacks than with str build. (less dmg reduciton less life)
I'm really puzzled as to how you came up with this. Firstly, there's many paths a DW Deulist can take. There is no 'usual' path. He can go:

Pure STR
STR w/splashes of DEX to equip Axes
STR/DEX
Pure DEX (My normal course)
DEX/INT to equip Daggers or Claws

The advantage of a DEX build is the sheer amount of Attack Speed you're able to obtain which can equal and in some cases surpass the Damage you would get from a pure STR build. DEX builds also have the option of taking Iron Reflexes which converts all Evasion into Armor. The nice thing about that is DEX grants a 1% Evasion bonus for every 5 points so you could actually have more Armor than someone with an equal amount of STR because STR doesn't offer an Armor bonus. STR grants extra Life and extra Melee Damage, which are both nice benefits, but that in no way has anything to do with Armor Reduction nor are the two benefits game changing as with the 6 linked sockets. A person who goes STR/DEX can have the exact same amount of Armor and Damage Reduction as a person who is pure STR or DEX. Simply being a hybrid does not mean you have to equip hybrid armor which will, in fact, gimp your build. You only need 153 in one attribute to equip the highest level armor. That's it, only 153. If, as a hybrid, you can't manage to acquire at least 150 in one if not both stats, then you've probably got a failed build on your hands.

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Krayt a écrit :
Also with 2h build u usually go AoF which is kinda OP right now.
Where do you get 'usually' from? AoF is extremely OP right now, that is correct, it is totally game breaking. How does that possible translate into 2h builds usually going AoF? It doesn't. It's a completely ridiculous statement. AoF is broken, that does NOT mean you have to take it. There are plenty of viable 2h builds that do not incorporate AoF at all and if you're playing a Deulist you probably shouldn't be anywhere near AoF anyway! An AoF Deulist will not be nearly as effective as a Templar or Marauder. I'm confident when I say that a 2h Deulist does NOT 'usually' go for AoF. My current build for instance is a Blood Magic/Life Regen Build. I'm level 40 at the moment in Ruthless, using a lvl 29 2h Axe, and still one shotting normal mobs in a party of 2. I've only aquired 36% Increased Damage from passives the rest is in Regen and attribute nodes, that's it. I'm certainly not at a loss for DPS and I rarely ever use a Flask because my Regen is great. This statement about 2h builds usually going AoF is completely absurd.

Flicker Strike is just as OP and broken as AoF. To say that builds based around these options are the most effective is really a moot argument. They're broken and shouldn't even be considered in the same light as other builds. Until they get fixed, they will always be OP and 'effective'. Your job, as a beta tester, should be to acknowledge that they are broken and move on to something else. If you're here to just play a game as easily as possible, then shame on you. There is no constructive feedback that can possibly come from playing a known OP, broken build that has been played to death. If you wan't to experience it for yourself, that's fine, but don't go making uninformed assumptions of what is best and what the 'usual' course of action is for any given build based upon conversations with people who may or may not have a clue as to what the hell they are talking about. For all you know, they could be just as inexperienced as you.

Getting back to DW vs 2h.. Neither is really more superior than the other. They each have their pros and cons and their own playstyles as they should in any properly balanced game.




I never used AoF and i hate flicker strike. What i meant that those things make this game little silly. I know they are going to be fixed and that's fine since it's beta and i am testing things not just looking for OP builds like u said.
Right now i went cleave build with axes on my duelist and i am breezing through cruelty fine. Upgraded some items and it's fun again. You just have to remember about using curses since that's what they are for ( i am so used to using curses as a caster that it took me some time to remember about using them as a mele :p ) . GOnna see how it goes later on. :)

For people interested i am on merciless right now and i am still doing fine. I can't wait for .96 to tweak my passives.

Dernière édition par Krayt, le 4 févr. 2012 09:37:33
I'm very noob in the gameplay, reading a lot and experimenting a little.
great reading you facelicker, thing's are brighter yet.

I'm trying atm to level a str/dex sword/shield cleave/shield charge duelist (loved D2 paladin's ^^, duelist's remind me a lot).
do you think he's some kind of survivability ?
if yes, what kind of passives may be the most interresting to take?

thanks.
... nothing
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__Z__ a écrit :
do you think he's some kind of survivability ?
if yes, what kind of passives may be the most interresting to take?
Survivability? Absolutely. Good DPS? Not so much. I have seen quite a few succesful people with sword and board characters, not many though. Gorlak in the Default league and Hendrock in the Hardcore league come to mind. I'm not sure exactly how they built their characters but here are a couple of my ideas. I played around with a few diffent builds and Blood Magic and Resolute Technique always seem to give good results. You can, of course, choose not to take either and instead spend those points as well as the points in extra life/regen into various passives that you think might suit you better.

http://poezone.ru/skilltree/#7oThis build is a good rounded character. Good attack speed and ok DPS for sword&board and a good amount of Life/regen and Armor too. He might not kill the fastest or tank the best but he can take on any situation.

http://poezone.ru/skilltree/#7pThis build is all about Defense and more Defense. With Warlord's Mark, Enduring Cry and Immortal Call, he'll live through anything. He might not kill the fastest, but he'll always live to tell the tale of each battle.

http://poezone.ru/skilltree/#7qThis build focuses more on weapon damage than defense. I generally try to stay away from specialising in my builds but this one I gave it a go. You can always switch out Blood Magic and/or Life/Regen for more damage.

You will have to equip Onyx Amulets or other attribute increasing gear to make up the difference in the builds that don't meet the attribute requirements. You should have almost 100 DEX from just the build and you only need 102 DEX to equip the level 60 swords. STR should be sufficient enough on every build to equip the highest level armor. You could always just change a couple nodes around too to meet the attribute requirements.

Dernière édition par FaceLicker, le 5 févr. 2012 13:37:26
Thank's facelicker for your wise advices!

yesterday I've tried flicker strike... and i'm an absolute fan already!
it's a blast for my gameplay style, i just move around madly, flick flick flick on every corner of the battlefield, it's so sick! my head is still turning round and round!
every other skill seem so slow in comparison!
(the drawbacks is that it's so adapted to my semi-mindless ultra quick style of gameplay i usually love and don't find anywhere, that it'll be hard for me now to play at slower pace...).

I'll go toward around the last build, with blood mana (already have it, it's a very usefull one!).

I've not already really figured how frenzy charges works, but i'll certainly go with that too.
and i like to keep the shield (armguard are they an viable option?) for safety blocks.

future comment's will be apreciated :).
... nothing

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