About Perfect Agony node on dot skills

Perfect Agony is only good for pure dot and crit build?

Viper Strike and Puncture don't work well with Perfect Agony ?

Bcos of initial hit get reduced by 30% it´s useful primarily for crit based DoT builds but you can test smth in PoB.

But the -30% less damage with hits penalty, would negatively affect the Viper Strike? Even having a high critical chance? Because Viper Strike use physical damage too..

That's why this is a question, if i'll use Viper Strike with Perfect Agony, i would not need to get physical damage on passive tree, and only focus on pure dot, crit or atk speed, right? Physical damage would be irrelevant?

Beacause of another point, the mechanic of poison say "The base damage per second dealt by a given application of poison equals 20% of the combined physical and chaos damage..."
So, according on POE wiki, if i lose physical damage, my poison hits will be weaker, and if i get the Perfect Agony, my hits and poison will be -30% more weaker, unless if a crit.

Summing up, worth i lose physical damage for get more dot, WHEN i crit?

Perfect Agony is really an useful and good node?

When you crit, 30% of your multiplier will be added to your "damage with ailments" calculation. so with viper strike if you crit for 1000 without perfect agony, and you have 100% increased damage from poison, and 100% increased damage from ailments, you would do;

Without perfect agony
1000+(1000*.4*(1+(1+1))) = 2200 damage per hit.

Let's say you have 400% increased critical strike multiplier;

With perfect agony
700+(700*.4*(1+(1+(1+(4*.3)))) = only 1876 per hit.

if we set these two formulas equal to each other and set our crit multiplier with perfect agony to x and solve for x, we can come with with the minimum crit multiplier to make this node worthwhile.


1000+(1000*.4*(1+(1+1))) = 700+(700*.4*(1+(1+(1+(x*.3))))
x = %786 crit multiplier.

Having more damage from poison and damage from ailments will drastically reduce the crit multiplier you need.

For example, if you have 200% increased poison damage and 200% damage from ailments, you would only need 119% crit multiplier. So if you ran with melee physical support, vile toxins support, deadly ailments, etc. and you were able to get 400+ crit multiplier, the DoT from viper strike would be very very strong

"

tuggernut a écrit :

When you crit, 30% of your multiplier will be added to your "damage with ailments" calculation. so with viper strike if you crit for 1000 without perfect agony, and you have 100% increased damage from poison, and 100% increased damage from ailments, you would do;

Without perfect agony
1000+(1000*.4*(1+(1+1))) = 2200 damage per hit.

Let's say you have 400% increased critical strike multiplier;

With perfect agony
700+(700*.4*(1+(1+(1+(4*.3)))) = only 1876 per hit.

if we set these two formulas equal to each other and set our crit multiplier with perfect agony to x and solve for x, we can come with with the minimum crit multiplier to make this node worthwhile.


1000+(1000*.4*(1+(1+1))) = 700+(700*.4*(1+(1+(1+(x*.3))))
x = %786 crit multiplier.

Having more damage from poison and damage from ailments will drastically reduce the crit multiplier you need.

For example, if you have 200% increased poison damage and 200% damage from ailments, you would only need 119% crit multiplier. So if you ran with melee physical support, vile toxins support, deadly ailments, etc. and you were able to get 400+ crit multiplier, the DoT from viper strike would be very very strong

I think you've messed up with a fact about Perfect Agony.

"

Modifiers to Critical Strike Multiplier also apply to Damage Multiplier for Ailments from Critical Strikes at 30% of their value; 30% less Damage with Hits.

Therefore, your calculation with Perfect Agony should be:

700+(1000*.4*(1+(1+(1+(4*.3)))) = 2380 damage per hit.

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Also, you seem to forget that critical multiplier also applies to HIT and the base critical multiplier is 150%. Assuming that 400% critical multiplier means 250% increase critical strike multiplier (since you use "4" in your calculation), so the correct calculation should be:

Without Perfect Agony;

1000*(1.5)+(1000*.4*(1+(1+1))) = 3200 damage per hit.

With Perfect Agony, 400% critical multiplier;

700*(4)+(1000*.4*(1+(1+(1+(4*.3)))) = 4500 damage per hit.

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But of course, you can't really compare two of these equations above since there are multiple variables involved here. I wouldn't try to equate both of the equations since there are no fixed opportunity costs (such that 400% increased critical multiplier = 400% increase damage with ailment). BTW, assuming the base damage to be 1000, the real equations are:

Without Perfect Agony;

[1000*(1.5+x)*(1+y)]+[1000*(0.4)*(1+z)] = Total Damage

With Perfect Agony;

[700*(1.5+x)*(1+y)]+[1000*(0.4)*(1+z)*(1.5+(x*0.3))] = Total Damage

x = %increased critical strike multiplier
y = %increased damage with hits
z = %increased damage with ailments

I think the last post was even more messed up.

From my understanding if you applying a base damage plus crit strike and a multiplier with 40% of that becoming a dot multiplied by the crit multiplier divided by 3.3 then.... 1000 shouldn't have ever been in the second equation of how much damage w/ perfect agony.

I wish it applied to all DoT effects. Crit Essence Drain please?

"

I think you've messed up with a fact about Perfect Agony.

"

Modifiers to Critical Strike Multiplier also apply to Damage Multiplier for Ailments from Critical Strikes at 30% of their value; 30% less Damage with Hits.

Therefore, your calculation with Perfect Agony should be:

700+(1000*.4*(1+(1+(1+(4*.3)))) = 2380 damage per hit.

_____________________________________________________________________

Also, you seem to forget that critical multiplier also applies to HIT and the base critical multiplier is 150%. Assuming that 400% critical multiplier means 250% increase critical strike multiplier (since you use "4" in your calculation), so the correct calculation should be:

Ever since the revamp that removed double dipping, modifiers to hit damage have no effect on ailment damage. Hits and ailments calculate their damage with completely seperate modifiers, so for the purpose of calculating the dot, the 30% less damage with hits is irrelivent, as is the effect of crit multiplier on the hit.

Ailments also still recieve the default 150% crit damage if they are applied by a crit. Crit multiplier has no futher effect on them unless you have perfect agony, which lets you bump that 150 up by 30% of any increased multiplier you have. So if you have 200% increased multiplier, and perfect agony, your ailments applied by crits will do 210% of the damage that the ailment would do if you did not crit - and again, the effect of the crit on the hit damage is a completely seperate calculation that will not interact with the ailment damage.