Ideal CoC Attack Speed?

When I used to play about a year ago I remember it was around 2.3 aps was ideal. But I saw a Youtube video recently where he said it was reduced to 2.05 now.

Can someone please clarify what the best aps for a CoC cyclone char is, thanks

I've not played a cast on crit build, yet. I'm interested though. I'm guessing the reason you wouldn't want to just stack as much as possible has something to do with the amount of times cast on crit procs in a second... If that's the reasoning then wouldn't the max optimal attack speed be the same as the CoC gems proc rate? Maybe that proc rate is listed on the wiki?

Either way, I'm interested in the responses you get.

That's depends on the build to be honest. But if you are talking about "shotguning nerf" thing, in this thread there are some mechanic explanation how to overcome it:

https://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/1344635

I also posted it in your earlier topic but in different context

I didn't do any math, but wiki says the spells cast have a 50ms cooldown. I've never built a CoC character, but I'd guess you'd cast 1 or 2 spells with supports? So, based on your crit chance, hit chance, and attack speed, there is going to a mathmatical point where you'll be throttled by the cooldown. I don't know how it can be determined 2.3 or 2.05 aps is ideal without knowing hit chance and crit chance.

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mark1030 a écrit :

I didn't do any math, but wiki says the spells cast have a 50ms cooldown. I've never built a CoC character, but I'd guess you'd cast 1 or 2 spells with supports? So, based on your crit chance, hit chance, and attack speed, there is going to a mathmatical point where you'll be throttled by the cooldown. I don't know how it can be determined 2.3 or 2.05 aps is ideal without knowing hit chance and crit chance.

50 ms mean that it is 50 milisecond. 1 millisecond is 1/1000 of second so actually the limist is 20 per second. Check the mechanic section from the build I posted above for more in-depth explanation xD

I can't really imagine any build getting throttled by the 50ms recharge on the CoC gem. You would have to proc cast on crit 20 times in a single second which includes the chance that you don't crit as well as the chance that you do crit and it doesn't proc.

If people are telling you to limit your attack speed for that reason I don't think they're right. There may be another reason though, I won't pretend to know everything.

CoC gives spells 50ms cooldown which means that each spell can proc 20 times per second. proc chance of lvl 20 CoC is 69%.

so in ideal case (where you want 20 procs of each spell every second while not wasting hits), you need to deal 29 crit hits per seconds (in average), spread over time so that each hit that procs procs the exact spell at the very exact time when it is no longer on cooldown

the variables are: proc or not (random based on proc chance), how many monsters are in area of effect and monster relative location to you and each other, chance to hit (semi-random) and the need of crit confirmation from accuracy/evasion (random), movement speed, and finally, attack speed

that beiig said, Id like to know, where the information about the existence of something called "ideal CoC aps" comes from

edit:

I say: the more aps you have, the better overall performace. It can be a waste in situations where there are many monsters around, but better against small groups. CoC builds problem is usually killing small groups of strong enemies or single target, while killing big packs is ez

Well for my old barrage build in 1.3, we never stacked more than 2.3 aps because anymore than that didn't help. I'm not sure if cyclone has the same mechanic though, and I'm not sure where the video I saw came up with 2.05 but...

If enough people say it doesn't matter, more is better, I guess I'll just go for more :)

I've looked into this recently, and I've found that the attack speed soft-cap was more for barrage builds than other types of CoC (ST, Cyclone, etc.)

The reason for this is because barrage fires so quickly on its own that if you have faster than 2.05 APS it causes the individual barrage projectiles to hit the target less than 0.05 seconds apart, and thus this means that some of them are wasted since CoC is still on cooldown.


None of this is my own math by the way.
Here are some sources if you would like to check them out:
Barrage CoC Build Thread
Barrage CoC APS Spreadsheet
1.3 Barrage CoC Thread - Outdated

The new ideal APS for a barrage CoC build is as close to 2.05 as you can get without going over.



Edit: I don't have solid numbers to back this up, but I would imagine it would be difficult to obtain more than 20 hits per second with cyclone or ST. It would be a complex calculation, as it would depend on number of enemies and their relative positioning to you. I would vote to just stack APS as high as you like and call it good.

Thanks ! At least someone has heard of what I'm talking about with the barrage cap thingy at 2.30. It's been a while since I played, but it's good to know my memory isn't totally shot.

So for cyclone, just stack as much speed as I can pretty much. Got it, thanks :)