Dear GGG: The balance of attrition. How to make leech FINALLY balanced. Please...
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Leech is currently one of the most lopsided and unbalanced forms of sustain in PoE2 that gets in the way of having a properly designed attrition system. The reason behind this is that it scales directly with player damage and... Player damage scales to deranged levels. If stacking damage equates to the player being unable to die unless they get one-shot then of course trying to balance player survive-ability is going to be a disaster.
The band-aid solution PoE2 currently has is for enemies to have 'leech resistance' that scales with their level, but it doesn't actually solve the problem. Stacking damage to become immune to non one-shots isn't properly addressed by this. It also makes lower damage builds unable to scale leech in any real capacity. The solution is simple: Make leech NOT scale on player damage. More specifically, modifiers to player damage. Change leech to only scale on the base damage and skill gem multiplier(s) of players' attacks (and spells). Follow this up by removing the leech resistance from enemies as it would be no longer necessary to counteract damage scaling. Certain specific modifiers could also have leech scaling added to them for balance reasons. Examples being gems such as 'Barrage', 'Chain' and 'Upheavel' which modify other skills to hit additional times, since their negative damage multipliers would no longer affect leech directly. Projectile attacks might have a slight advantage in regards to scaling leech due to modifiers for additional projectiles counting as more base damage. IF this ends up being the case then perhaps leech could also have an innate property where it's 50% more effective for melee attacks, but sources of '#% attack damage leeched as' are 33% lower in order to equalize things more. Alternatively, leech could simply be 33% less effective for projectile hits. There you go. Now leech has balanced scaling. P.S. On the topic of leech can you also please fix the new issue with the ES leech ascendancy the Acolyte of Chayula has. Dernière édition par LVSviral#3689, le 5 mai 2025 à 00:30:52 Dernier bump le 11 mai 2025 à 17:45:17
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" POE 1 lowkey already does it, just really sneakily. Currently in POE 1 there are "Players cannot leech" map modifiers, which force the player to use "20 Life GAINED on hit" instead of "% Damage leeched as life". Life Gained on hit is exactly what you're asking for, except It also scales with attack speed and number of projectiles. So to effectively circumvent the leech restrictions the players instead build into Molten Strike Of Zenith stacking attack speed and number of projectiles, Tornado Shot, or anything that has a lot of projectiles and hits 10 times per second. The result is the same, the players are attacking 10 times per second and hitting 30 different enemies with 30 different projectiles gaining their entire life pool back every tick of the server. It's even more powerful than leech, literally impossible to die as long as you keep attacking. |
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" That is very different actually. While attack speed would increase leech rate, although attack speed in PoE2 is a lot more limited than PoE1, that is where the similarity ends. 'Life on hit' scales with hit rate, but not base damage at all. Even if you are hitting up to dozens of times per enemy per second that does not mean you are doing more base damage than a more single hit focused attack. However, you bring up a decent point in that modifiers and skills that lower damage, but increase the amount of hits a skill does, would need special adjustment. I added this to the OP: " Dernière édition par LVSviral#3689, le 11 avr. 2025 à 00:05:22
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Day 3,894. GGG still hasn't fixed attrition mechanics.
Dernière édition par LVSviral#3689, le 12 avr. 2025 à 23:16:55
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bump
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Yet another bump.
Please GGG, balance player attrition so players have more viable build options. |
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Patch 10,207. Player healing is still not balanced so GGG won't get rid of enemies 1 shotting tank builds...
Dernière édition par LVSviral#3689, le 10 mai 2025 à 18:43:08
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bump.
My 2 cents on one-shot mechanics. Suppose they are fully removed form the game. Bosses now have a new mechanic. Anytime they successfully deal damage to you, they inflict a stacking rebuff on you that cannot be removed by other means or have its duration lowered. For a fixed amount of time, the boss deals X% more damage to you. (or have X% more damage reduction, or something like this...) The value of X depends on the pre-milaged incoming damage. Maybe thorns and other retaliation effects mitigate X further. These can stack with many intances but they count as separated instances and do not refresh. They should last a significantly long time (maybe 4 seconds? 8 seconds?) The point is to remove 1 shots and instead, punish players for getting continuously hit by abilities, but not punish players who dodge most abilities... I don't know if 1 shot moves is really a problem though....but this might be a training wheels that help players learn the mechanics better to prepare them for the actual thing. |
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" Endgame is a thug of war between incoming dps VS your hps. I just realized that often I don't survive small packs that I walked through earlier. Kinda awkward then I cleared 80% of the map, suddenly I died 3 times on a small group that I pulverized before. And I though... leech was the issue. More enemies -> more leech. Often enemies cant even reach me. I mean its same for me. I have [Resolute Technique] and I just swing the air. Theres no damage if enemy is out of reach. A simple solution to tone back leech: reduce leech from AOE sources. 95% of "defensive" gems are about heal too. I wanted to be a full tank, yet my only options are %max life / second %max life / kill leech I cant reduce incoming damage. :D |
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" A good way to phrase it. As long as healing makes the tug of war too erratic then enemies HAVE TO be able to kill you in the blink of an eye because there is no other way for them to be a threat. All other sources of healing besides leech are mostly controlled variables that can be easily balanced and adjusted. Leech being tied to PoE2's wild damage output makes it uniquely impossible to balance. Hence the idea to make it only scale on base damage. " I've played multiple games that actually do something like this. It would probably be a bit more convoluted in PoE, but it has proof of concept. " Yeah, I would much prefer if healing wasn't as crazy and tank stats were instead better. Being able to take hits and have a moving healthbar is a lot more fun and engaging than being always on full life until you are dead. Dernière édition par LVSviral#3689, le 11 mai 2025 à 17:45:54
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