Minions DPS after hotfix

First, I just want to mention I'm an outlier in terms of DPS because my gear cost around 6000 divs and Im still using legacy gear.

With that in mind lets go to raw numbers for analysis:

Before 0.2 i was dealing 170k per minion and I had 17 minions

After I was dealing 36k per minion and now have 13 :
36/170 x 13/17 = 16 % of the damage I used to deal (bricked)

After the hotfix they applied hours ago I now deal 76k per minion :
76/170 x 13/17 = 34 % of the damage I used to deal (hard nerf)

Edit : So I didn't realize they've also nerfed pain offering. All the damage calculations prior are without that buff.

I'm not exactly sure about the numbers with offering, but I know my damage was more than 2.2x with it and is now 1,4x instead. That's actually a huge nerf.

So if we take the same last two calculations (16 % and 34 %) and factor in the pain offering nerf we get:

16 x 1.4/2.2 = 10 % (Totally bricked)
34 x 1.4/2.2 = 21.6 % (Extremely nerfed for standard, bricked for new league)

No wonder why people are very angry. You in fact in 2.0 rendered the damage to 10 % to what i previously was and with the hotfix it's now 21.6 %.

Between bricked vs hard nerfed , I obviously prefer the latter.

With these in mind, now lets transition in the new economy where ingenuity is now 30% instead of the 90 one I use (leads to less spirit from ventors). The secptres are now +4 instead of +5 and the trenchtimbre is +2 instead of +4.

Also factor in, almost nobody have the jewel setup I have because theyre extremely rare and expensive. Theres very little chance a minion player, even with the buffs in the new economy will be able to clear a T4 simulacrum without some new mechanic I'm unaware of. So far the spectres have been very underwhelming.

Simss is the zone I have played the most, Im currently sitting with 230 simulacrum stones in my stash because thats all I was doing pre-patch. So I'm very familiar with how this zone is hard and how it works.

I just wished that GGG would use my account as a test dummy for DPS output and factor in the gap between the new econ vs legacy gear because honestly, they nerfed too many aspects of the witch synergy.

The witch Minion DPS mainly comes from:

1. Gem Level scaling
2. Jewel nodes
3. Spirit (number of minions)

These 3 components all have been hard nerfed. Also Against the Darkness jewel is now bricked because It cannot find a decent spot on the tree.

With the Lich, at least you get a jewel node doubled and 30% chaos extra damage. So it feels like Infernalist is in a bad spot vs Lich, especially that they've removed the 20% damage taken on the hellhoud first.

GGG also removed many native minion DPS nodes, and notables such as :
1. Two Pronged Attack
2. Resourceful Ally

I'm not sure what led to this sheer hate on the minion build but on paper, it was clear from the get go reading the patch notes of 0.2 that minion were bricked.

I appreciate the buff from 10 % to 21.6 %, but it will not cut it in the new economy. I'm affraid for a lot of players. They will be able to clear T15 maps but the pinnacle content such as T4 sims might be impossible for them or extremely hard to the point that a fraction of a percent might do it with a minion build in the new econ. It's fixable, I just hope GGG can see clearly the numbers and be more thoughtful before bricking a funny class like minions.

Ingenuity is (left ring 20-30% right ring 20-30%) so basically 1 exalt worth for a near perfect 30-30 roll. I would rather have 3 charms from a generic belt than 60% of a ring in a belt slot. It is much worse than you think.

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Soulscar1#4896 a écrit :

Ingenuity is (left ring 20-30% right ring 20-30%) so basically 1 exalt worth for a near perfect 30-30 roll. I would rather have 3 charms from a generic belt than 60% of a ring in a belt slot. It is much worse than you think.

Ah, it's much worse than I've thought, i thought the new max was 50, you're saying it's 30.

This seems over the top nerfed. Whats even the point of clearing pinnacle content if the items you are getting are hot trash?

They also nerfed the flask... These items were so legendary pre-patch, it was so fun to hunt them.

If the number is really 30%, instead of the 80% it had (up to 97 with a vaal i think), then that's brutal.

Even with the addition of the Spectre skill and related new spirit passive nodes, any actual minion playstyle is a lost cause, especially in the case of very specific bossing runs where corpse generation or small mobs don't exist to generate effects.

It was as early as Act 2 that it became untenable to play a truly zoo or focused minion style. I worked to test 7 separate spectres with various results and AI behavior tricks, but it doesn't matter. Nerfs and revive hits were ridiculous.

The scariest monster in the game as a zoomancer is, without a doubt, the doorway leading to a big fight. Just a thought, but here's an algorithm that may help:
- If the minion pathfinding results in rubberbanding or a failure to reach the player's (presence?) radius for more than 1 second, trigger the spectre's floating mist effect to bring the minion to within 5m of:
- The nearest currently aggro'd monster based on the player's flag such that it does not collide with non-pathfindable map surface
- The random selected point within the 5m radius around the player such that it does not collide with non-pathfindable map surface

At the current state of play, resorting to gas cloud ignite explosions or the best 2 summons in the game (Essence Drain and Contagion) are the only ways to realistically progress.

"

loesr#4862 a écrit :

Even with the addition of the Spectre skill and related new spirit passive nodes, any actual minion playstyle is a lost cause, especially in the case of very specific bossing runs where corpse generation or small mobs don't exist to generate effects.

It was as early as Act 2 that it became untenable to play a truly zoo or focused minion style. I worked to test 7 separate spectres with various results and AI behavior tricks, but it doesn't matter. Nerfs and revive hits were ridiculous.

The scariest monster in the game as a zoomancer is, without a doubt, the doorway leading to a big fight. Just a thought, but here's an algorithm that may help:
- If the minion pathfinding results in rubberbanding or a failure to reach the player's (presence?) radius for more than 1 second, trigger the spectre's floating mist effect to bring the minion to within 5m of:
- The nearest currently aggro'd monster based on the player's flag such that it does not collide with non-pathfindable map surface
- The random selected point within the 5m radius around the player such that it does not collide with non-pathfindable map surface

At the current state of play, resorting to gas cloud ignite explosions or the best 2 summons in the game (Essence Drain and Contagion) are the only ways to realistically progress.

It's actually much worse than what I've previously calculated. I wasnt aware theyve also nerfed pain offering and I updated my original post.

After 2.0, my minion dealt 10 % of what they used to do with pain offering.
With the hot fix they are now doing 21.6% of the combined DPS they used to.

In standard, at 21.6 % with a god tier outlier build, it's still doable but a real stuggle to beat a T4 sims. In the new econ, it must feel absolutely dog poop.

"

Oinkaments#6390 a écrit :

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Soulscar1#4896 a écrit :

Ingenuity is (left ring 20-30% right ring 20-30%) so basically 1 exalt worth for a near perfect 30-30 roll. I would rather have 3 charms from a generic belt than 60% of a ring in a belt slot. It is much worse than you think.

Ah, it's much worse than I've thought, i thought the new max was 50, you're saying it's 30.

This seems over the top nerfed. Whats even the point of clearing pinnacle content if the items you are getting are hot trash?

They also nerfed the flask... These items were so legendary pre-patch, it was so fun to hunt them.

If the number is really 30%, instead of the 80% it had (up to 97 with a vaal i think), then that's brutal.

It is two rolls left and right 20% to 30% with a perfect vaal being around 2 x 36% having a monumentally small chance of that happening. It now has 1-2 charm slots and some other irrelevant modifier.

Yep dead on. No way is it worth doing pinnacle content for salty garbage.